February 17 – 22, 2000
These restored messages come from the Quilt History List, an online forum where quilt historians, collectors, researchers, appraisers, and enthusiasts discussed antique quilts and related textiles. The archive dates from 1996 through approximately 2016 and is being restored gradually. Sign up in the form at the bottom of the page if you want to know when a new page is added. Original spelling, opinions, formatting, and inactive links may remain unchanged.
Primary topics of this QHL Digest:
- Wool Dye Fading Debate Continues — Members compare notes on natural dyes, sheep’s wool, and personal dyeing experience to settle whether wool truly resists fading better than other fibers. (see the article on natural dyes)
- The “Hidden in Plain View” Underground Railroad Debate Intensifies — The digest’s dominant and most contentious thread: members weigh the popular quilt-code book’s claims against documented history of slave cloth, with the discussion explicitly tied to Black History Month. (see the article on Underground Railroad quilts)
- Do Quilters Live Longer? — A lighthearted demographic question — whether quilters live longer than average — opens a new discussion thread that continues into the next digest.
- Block and Pattern History Queries — Members ask about the history of the “anvil” and “nested triangles” blocks, and share other research requests including EGA program information and Denver Art Museum catalogs.
Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2000 08:34:59 EST | From: Midnitelaptop@
in watching the boutis demonstration on the “georgia bonesteel in france” tape.the “thread” used to stuff the designs. was like the rope/thread used to make piping.
different widths for different design areas. the french lady who demonstrated. inserted the thread/rope, by separating the threads of the fabric so that when it was finished you couldn’t tell where it had started. Georgia used some heavy gauge nylon yarn.on her design. that she had quilted by machine the quilt design has to be a double line to fit the thread/rope through
Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 12:52:47 +1100 | From: Sven Olsson <sven@>
Hello Folks,
I have just been browsing nad have come across a quilt top that I have never seen before. Has anyone got any clues??
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=262825959 Lorraine in Oz
Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2000 21:26:25 EST | From: Chyral@
In a message dated 02/17/2000 85252 PM Eastern Standard Time, sven@ writes
> I have just been browsing nad have come across a quilt top that I have never seen before. Has anyone got any clues??
> http://cgi.ebay.com.au/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=262825959
A completed example of this quilt is plate # 185 in Woodard & Greenstein’s “Twentieth Century Quilts“…… They date it to 1940, and state the pattern name is “Trees and Garlands,” and that the quilt was commercially produced for sale in stores like Gimbel’s dept. store in NY.
Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2000 22:31:36 -0500 | From: Maxine <MaxQuilts@>
>Has anyone toured the Textile Museum in Lowell?? With husband and 2 teenage daughters in tow, how long would it take to see it? We will be
out
>there next summer and planning itinerary!
>Thanks!
>Jennifer in Iowa
Jennifer, don’t forget to stop by The Brush Art Gallery and Studios (across the courtyard from the National Park Visitor Center) and say hello.
Maxine
Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2000 23:30:16 -0500 (EST) | From: “Joanna E. Evans” <jevans@>
We hope you are planning to come to Bloomington, Indiana, the first weekend in March. There will be many quilting events around town, including the Bloomington Quilters Guild New Millennium Quilt Show and the Indiana Heritage Quilt Show.
For two days in March, the John Waldron Arts Center will be awash in colorful quilts made by the 120 members of the diversely talented Bloomington Quilters’ Guild. Several hundred quilts and quilted items will be hung, draped, and scattered about the Arts Center. The Auditorium will be packed with guild members’ quilts and a special exhibit of quilts and quilt-related ephemera from the 1930s. The Flashlight Gallery will be filled with a special exhibition of quilts that will be donated to area children in need. Each year the guild, as a service project, makes dozens of children’s quilts; in the past, these quilts have been donated to Monroe County United Ministries’ daycare center, Public Health Nursing, and the police department. Items made and donated by guild members will be available for purchase in the guild’s Treasure Shop in the Firebay. In addition, viewers who are inspired to take try their hand at this art form may purchase supplies from vendors in the Firebay.
The John Waldron Arts Center is located at the corner of South Walnut and Fourth Streets. Parking is available across the street at the Fourth Street Garage. The Arts Center is only two blocks from the Bloomington Convention Center, where the Indiana Heritage Quilt Show will be held on March 2-4, 9am-6pm.
The Bloomington Quilters’ Guild New Millennium Quilt Show Friday, March 3, 2000, 9am-8pm
Saturday, March 4, 2000, 9am-4pm
Admission $3 at the door (Children ages 10 and under, free with an adult.) John Waldron Arts Center, 122 South Walnut Street, Bloomington, IN For more information, contact Joanna Evans at 812-331-1479 or jevans@.
Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2000 21:27:25 -0800 | From: “Christine Thresh” <christine@>
Oh, Mary Waller,
I loved what you wrote (both parts). The treadle machine history was good and accurate. However, I got such a kick out of the quilting myth section. I printed it out for my husband and he read it aloud and had a good laugh. He read, again, “My goodness, Ellie May, every time I hang this quilt out to air, runaway slaves start coming out from behind the barn!” During the evening we both said aloud “My goodness, Ellie May!” several times. Thanks for adding humor to this discussion which has been very -( serious )-
I have the book and I have read it twice and it makes me sigh. I heard it has sold 50,000 copies. My goodness!
Christine Thresh http://www.winnowing.com/
Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2000 01:38:05 EST | From: EllynLK@
Since the Hidden In Plain View subject has come up yet again…. As some of you may know, I work in television in Los Angeles and I often piece during the “hurry up and wait” periods (this week I am piecing and “waiting” at the Grammy Awards rehearsals). I was working last week on “Greed,” a gameshow when I got to talking to a woman I didn’t know. Turns out she is a producer on “Greed,” having recently left her previous post– as a producer on “Simply Quilts”!
I told her I belonged to this list. “Oh, they were really upset about that underground railroad show,” she noted without prompting from me. She said they had received a great deal of mail about the show. She was aware of the discussion– one person’s family story writ large by this book without a great deal of other evidence to back it up; patterns mentioned that were not of the time period, etc. Her reasoning for the show was that it isn’t very often that popular culture (i.e. a new book, promoted on Oprah and elsewhere) meets up in such a big way with quilting and intersects somewhere in the public conscience.
Didn’t have much time to talk to her… I went to the office to get an ID badge, met this woman, started talking, discovered we liked quilts, took her to my post on stage to show her my current work, a quilt for my mom (“oh,” she cooed, “your points all meet.”) and then discovered she had produced many, many “Simply Quilts” episodes. It all spilled out at once, not more than a five-minute conversation and the we all went back to work. I have also worked on a number of TV shows of particular interest to the African-American community and, because I’m “piecing in plain view,” have been approached by numerous African-American crew/staff who are quliters and/or related to quilters. I’m always asking who made the quilts they have, what stories they remember that go with them, etc. And it’s only anecdotal, I know, but not a single one has ever told me, “You know, quilts were used on the underground railroad.” The best story I’ve collected was from a black make-up artist who brought a quilt to show me… her grandmother had been a seamstress at a very pricey and prestigious Los Angeles department store in the 1920’s and made a quilt constructed entirely of scraps left over from pieces of suits and dresses she altered for the wealthy. The quilt was a wreck (foundation pieced and for the most part, only the foundation fabric survived) but with vestiges of these wonderful fabrics a woman worked with as she tried to feed her family so long ago…
Lauri Klobas
Pacific PaKarendes, California where more rain is expected on Sunday– Hooray!
Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2000 08:08:30 -0600 | From: LAHughes <kehughes@>
Hello all,
I so enjoy this list. It has given me many moments of solace through difficult times over the last few months. Just now, I’m de-lurking to cry out for help.
I had masked off a center medallion on a wonderful quilt compiled of swapped 1/2 squares back in September. I then experienced a major life trauma. Of course everything was pushed aside. The bottom line is that I’ve just now come around to feeling a bit of myself again and finished quilting the center portion of that quilt to get it onto my bed. Of course, the masking tape left an ugly residue. I was disgusted. Quilt soap did nothing. In a less then lucid moment, I liberally squirted “Goop Off” over the residue and it easily wiped off, but now the quilt is imbedded with that sickening orange/citrus scent and traces of oil in the center area on the lighter patterned backing, where it was treated. Any ideas to remove that awlful scent? This quilt has become a trial unto itself. The batting is Warm and Natural, if I remember correctly. Yes, there are a multitude of reds in the quilt top. I’ve tried soaking it in a dilute white vinegar bath, which helped with the backing and some of the scent, and I’m sleeping under it again. I just can’t get this smell out of my head though.
Any ideas?
Lori
Michigan
Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2000 12:21:43 EST | From: Midnitelaptop@
very often you hear researchers say “so far, the info on this product, is anecdotal and until it has been run through standardized tests we can not authentically approve this product”…
let’s just say that this is true of all of the anecdotes in the book, about quilts and the underground RR. the only authentic history we have, so far, are the records kept by organizations like the Quakers, who initiated the movement…
so,how about, let’s put it to bed(under a beautiful quilt) for awhile and see if it ever passes authentically approved tests.
i would imagine most of us are tired of the whole thing. and it seems like neither side of the debate has changed it’s collective mind.
so why don’t we just, move on..
I am trying to research the history of tea cozys/cozies. can anyone tell me where to start?
Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2000 10:11:19 -0800 | From: “Christine Thresh” <christine@>
Continuing to beat a pretty frisky horse, “Hidden in Plain View,” one might ask where did slaves get cloth to make quilts?
I recently re-read “Up From Slavery” by Booker T. Washington. He was born a slave in 1858 or 1859. Cloth was a scarce commodity for slaves. He said, “The most trying ordeal I was forced to endure as a slave boy, however, was the wearing of a flax shirt. In the portion of Virginia where I lived it was common to use flax as part of the clothing for the slaves. That part of the flax from which our clothing was made was largely the refuse, which of course was the cheapest and roughest part. I can scarcely imagine any torture, except, perhaps, the pulling of a tooth, that is equal to that caused by putting on a new flax shirt for the first time. It is almost equal to the feeling that one would experience if he had a dozen or more chestnut burrs, or hundred small pinpoints, in contact with his flesh. Even to this day I can recall accurately the tortures that I underwent when putting on one of these garments…In connection with the flax shirt, my brother John, who is several years older than I am, performed one of the most generous acts that I ever heard of one slave doing for another. On several occasions, when I was being forced to wear a new flax shirt, he generously agreed to put it on in my stead and wear it for several days, till it was ‘broken in.’ Until I had grown to be quite a youth this single garment was all that I wore.”
Then, in Edward Ball’s book, “Slaves in the Family” he searched thousands of family records to trace the lives of slaves owned by his family. He wrote, “The first person in slavery to the Balls who can be identified by name was a woman called Bella. On November 10, 1720, Elias [Ball] made a note that ‘Bella had of me 3 yards of negero cloth.’ It was a Thursday. ” ‘Negro cloth’ was a coarse blend of wool and cotton that slaves were given for garments, a fabric manufactured in Europe and distributed by American slave owners. Whites did not wear Negro cloth, whose name and texture separated servers from served. The fabric sometimes took another more poetic name, ‘oznaburgs,’ from Osnabruck, a town in northern Germany known for its textiles. The rough blue or sometimes white cloth was the standard uniform on the Ball plantations from the earliest colonial days until well into the 1800s.
“To judge from the small size of her allotment of cloth, Bella must have been young, perhaps ten years old. In the practice taking shape, adults received five or more yards of oznaburgs per year, children about three yards. Bella appears in the account book several times, always in the context of taking her basic needs for survival– usually cloth but also blankets and occasionally a pair of shoes. According to the slave lists, Bella lived for at least another thirty-three years. No record of her birth or death, no record of children, if she had them, has survived. We know her only as a person trying to clothe herself.”
I believe quite a lot of oral history is accurate. So did Edward Ball whose meticulous written family records substantiated many stories passed down orally by slave family descendents. He interviewed Emily Frayer, who was born Emily Bryant in 1901. Mrs. Frayer told him (based on tales told to her by her mother about her grandmother), “They used to distribute the cloth, twice a year. When they gettin’ married, they got cloth, too.”
Oral history confirmed
Bell recounts a family story Frayer told about February 1865, on the lawn at Limerick [a Bell plantation], in the last hour of slavery. “‘My grandmother,'” she began, ‘she was standing in the door….and the Yankees come through, and take her hat off. My grandmother said she had a skullcap on, and he took it off her head, and throw ’em up. The Yankee said, “You’re free as a bird in the air!” She said she drop on her knee and said, “Thank God!”…'”
Then, Bell tells his family story of waiting for Sherman, “nearly the same as Mrs. Frayer’s, only reversed as in a mirror….
‘We felt hopeless [and] looked forward with dread,’ Mary Ball wrote in her memoir…When the Federal soldier reached Limerick, a cavalryman in uniform rode up to the mansion….’ Mary Ball described how the black village had gathered–field hands, cooks, boatmen, nurses…children, old people–and the Yankee had stood in front…’ The Yankee said, according to Mary Ball, ‘You are free! Free as a bird, you don’t have to work any more.'” Very convincing documentation, I think. I highly recommend Ball’s book, published by Farrar, Straus and Giroux in 1998. Not much about fabric, nothing about old quilts, but it gives us Underground Railroad settings and conditions in detail.
Christine Thresh on an island in the California Delta http://www.winnowing.com/
Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2000 15:30:59 +0400 | From: Xenia Cord <xecord@>
I, too, have a document that mentions cloth for slaves. I have a handwritten account book kept by a weaver from 1751 through 1782. At one point when settling his father’s estate (1768) he records a fee for “negor cotin” for “Shakespear.” However, in another place, in 1766, he records a fee for yardage of osnaburg for britches, presumably for himself.
Xenia
Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2000 19:35:23 -0600 | From: “Gail E. Hurn” <hghurn@>
I have heard that wool does not fade from light. Does anyone have evidence that this is true? Have you seen fading on old wool quilts?
Gail Hurn
Amish Quilt Connection http://www.amishquiltconnection.com
Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2000 23:09:48 EST | From: @aol.com
I would think that would depend entirely on the dye used. Some dyes are very lightfast (indigo blue keeps well, as does Turkey red), while most yellows prior to chrome yellow will fade whether you use them on silk, wool, linen, or what have you. I’ve never heard that wool as a fabric didn’t fade, though.
Karen Evans
Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2000 18:31:36 -0800 | From: monikaj@
Wool color fades just like cottons or silk. Just look at older hooked (my new love) and braided carpets.
Monika
Grants Pass, OR monikaj@
Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2000 21:42:44 -0800 | From: “Christine Thresh” <christine@>
Midnightlaptop wrote
“so,how about, let’s put it to bed(under a beautiful quilt) for awhile and see if it ever passes authentically approved tests.
i would imagine most of us are tired of the whole thing. and it seems like neither side of the debate has changed it’s collective mind.
so why don’t we just, move on.”
I don’t understand this. Why would anyone want to stop learning about old quilts, their makers, symbolism, and the Underground Railroad? I for one, will continue to search out information and if I find anything pertinent I’ll send it in to QHL. I don’t see this as a “debate.”
Christine Thresh http://www.winnowing.com/
Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2000 22:02:28 -0800 | From: “Christine Thresh” <christine@>
Gail Hurn wrote to ask if wool faded from light.
During my study of dyeing wool with natural dyes, we always pinned swatches of freshly dyed wool fabric on the south side of the house and left them there for several weeks to a month. I kept control swatches in the house in a dark area. Some dyes such as indigo did not fade much at all, some purples from logwood darkened, and some yellows (from all sorts of plants) faded away almost back to the raw wool color. Others held up very well. Onion skins stay bright. The natural dyes are quite amazing. Try putting a modern swatch of fabric out in the sun for a few weeks and see what happens! Sheep walk around outdoors all the time with hardly any fading, even the black ones.
Christine Thresh http://www.winnowing.com/
Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 17:58:40 +1100 | From: Sven Olsson <sven@>
> Sheep walk around outdoors all the time with hardly any fading, even the black ones.
> Christine Thresh http://www.winnowing.com/
I don’t know about sheep in the US, but as a child here in Australia, I had a pet sheep that was a “black sheep”, and after she was shorn she was the blackest black. But half way through the season, she was barely distinguishable for the rest of the flock. She would have the blondest tips, but the closer you got to her skin, the darker she was.
(I grew up on a sheep property in South Australia in the 50s and 60s)
Lorraine in Oz
Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 08:02:54 -0500 | From: “Diane McGuire” <dianemcg@>
Hi, QHLers,
I watched the tape of the movie about Sally Hemings over the weekend. Did any of you see it? I spent a lot of time talking back to the tv about the historical inaccuracies. I start SCREAMING when they showed the quilt supposedly made by the Hemmings family. This is around 1796 or so (didn’t catch the exact year mentioned at that part in the movie.) The quilt was large white squares with double sashing. On each square was the appliqui of a full length fabric “picture” of that member of the family. The character went through and named the people represented on each square including Sally’s son Thomas (who was fairly certainly Jefferson’s son as proven by DNA tests lately done).
I have been a member of this list for three years and I have learned quite a bit about quilt history. Was I right to be upset about this? How far off was it? I can’t think of anything before the Baltimore album style that would lend itself to this kind of appliqui. I know small people were embroidered on samplers and done in needlepoint in the 18th century, but quilts?
Diane in still icy but melting Massachusetts
Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 07:35:23 -0800 | From: “Christine Thresh” <christine@>
Lorraine in Oz wrote
“I don’t know about sheep in the US, but as a child here in Australia, I had a pet sheep that was a “black sheep”, and after she was shorn she was the blackest black. But half way through the season, she was barely distinguishable for the rest of the flock. She would have the blondest tips, but the closer you got to her skin, the darker she was.
(I grew up on a sheep property in South Australia in the 50s and 60s)”
Lorraine,
I bow to your expertise. If you observed this in Australia, you know what you are talking about. Thanks for setting me straight. I have not been in close contact with sheep, I’ve just observed them from a car window as I drove by pastures.
Christine Thresh on an island in the California Delta where there are not any sheep http://www.winnowing.com/
Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 08:56:39 -0700 | From: Janet Finley <j_finley@>
OUT OF PRINT Denver Art Museum Catalogues – Limited quanities available. The Denver Art Museum, OUT OF PRINT catalogues, a few copies available at The
Rocky Mountain Quilt Museum’s QuiltMarket gift shop You need to e-mail Pat Moore at (PatKoerner@) or call (303) 215-9001 and ask for Pat or Connie.
Master Card or Visa accepted.
(1) “The Denver Art Museum, Quilts and Coverlets”, Imelda G. DeGraw, 1974, ISBN
0-914738-02-x. Mostly B/W. Informative text. $12.00 plus S/H. (2) “American Patchwork Quilt,” the Denver Art Museum,” Imelda G. DeGraw, 1986, a bi-lingual publication in Japanese and English. Beautiful color plates and close-up details of 50 quilts sent to Japan in 1986 on exhibit. Excellent essay by Imelda McGraw about the nature of the collection. Quilts in the catalogue date from mid-1800s to the 1940s. Color reproduction is good to excellent as is the lighting to bring out the quilting definition. Each quilt has a brief write-up. $15.00 plus S/H.
Janet Finley – RMQM Exhibit Committee
Golden, CO j_finley@
Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 10:59:01 EST | From: Midnitelaptop@
john woolman, an historic quaker, once said…
One day, being under a strong exercise of spirit, I stood up and said some words in a meeting; but not keeping close to the divine opening, I said more than was required of me.
I know it’s february and most of us in the wintery part of this planet are tired, cold and getting cranky…but..to paraphrase John Woolman… Maybe we have all said more than was required about the subject of slavery and the URR
Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 12:39:22 -0600 | From: Laura Hobby Syler <texas_quilt.co@>
Sorry to post to the list,
Martha Wroolie,
Please contact me privately. I’ve lost your snail address for your VQTS newsletter subscription….
Thanks,
Laura
Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 22:20:53 -0000 | From: “Michele Nicol-Hilton” <michele@>
Hello everybody
I am in the process of sorting out my new sewing room – I have never had a dedicated room before so I’m feeling pretty pleased.
I am refurbishing an old Chest of Drawers that I keep (some of) my fat quarters in and have decided to stencil some quilters expressions on it…
Anu suggestions other than
She who dies with the most fabric wins ( a little morbid I thought) As off-subject please e-mail me privately and I’ll share on request.
Thanks, Michele
Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 20:00:25 EST | From: Xroadclown@
I’m interested in the history of two blocks. One is called “anvil” and the second is called “nested triangles” and/or “old-maid’s puzzle” Our quilting retreat group will be celebrating two members 50th birthdays at this retreat, and we have decided to make them blocks!!! any history will be well appreciated.
thanks, melanie ( where the kids are home from school, and i’m glad we have a TV) ****************************************************************************** ****
“Families are like quilts lives pieced together, stitched with smiles and tears, colored with memories, bound with LOVE.”
Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 21:31:48 EST | From: KareQuilt@
I have begun to explore the Internet for more information on slavery and the underground railroad. Tonight I discovered the following http://www.historychannel.com/
Then click “To view all HistoryChannel.com recommended sites click here”. Then click “AFRICAN AMERICAN HISTORY”. Then click “Excerpts from Slave Narratives”.
This is one such excerpt from this page
During the early nineteenth century, some slaves continued to draw upon West
African religious customs in burying the dead. In this selection, Charles Ball, a slave in western Maryland, describes a slave funeral I assisted her and her husband to inter the infant…and its father buried with it, a small bow and several arrows; a little bag of parched meal; a miniature canoe, about a foot long, and a little paddle, (with which he said it would cross the ocean to his own country) a small stick, with an iron nail, sharpened and fastened into one end of it; and a piece of white muslim, with several curious and strange figures painted on it in blue and red, by which, he said, his relations and countrymen would know the infant to be his son, and would receive it accordingly, on its arrival amongst them…He cut a lock of hair from his head, threw it upon the dead infant, and closed the grave with his own hands. Hen then told us the God of his country was looking at him, and was pleased with what he had done.
Source Charles Ball, Slavery in the United States A Narrative of the Life and Adventures of Charles Ball, A Black Man (New York, 1837).
Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 21:53:01 EST | From: KareQuilt@
I got bumped off line and tried to recreate the instructions I just gave you to get back to the slave narratives, and could not do it so I had to try to retrace my steps in order to figure out how I found this site in the first place! Try this path instead.
http://www.historychannel.com/Undergroundrailroad
Then on the right hand corner of this page click on the box that says “Related Websites.” Then click on “To view all HistoryChannel.com recommended sites click here.” Then click on AFRICAN AMERICAN HISTORY;
then click on “Excerpts From Slave Narratives.”
Karen Alexander
Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 22:18:10 EST | From: Palampore@
My daughter came home today and said that they had 2 black teachers talk to the entire 3rd grade (80+ children) about “those” quilts today as part of Black History Month. I had already told her about how I disagreed with this last year when they were told that the quilts were used as signs for the UGRR. I asked her what did they do? She said that they brought quilts made by their mothers and said that those were some of the patterns were used by the UGRR. (This has now been done in her entire school for 2 years.) I asked her if she spoke up and told them her mother’s opinion. She said, “No, I couldn’t. I would have been embarassed.”
I want desperately to say something, but I don’t know how to do this and not start a battle. It angers me when history is treated this way and is accepted.
Would appreciate private emails regarding this. Don’t want to get another war going on this site.
Thanks, Lynn Lancaster Gorges, New Bern, NC
Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 22:22:20 -0400 | From: edwa@
(Always leave room for another word)
I realize that the subject has been talked and talked and I agree that no minds will be changed but based on the number of instances I have read on other Digests about “the book” “the symbolism of the blocks” etc etc etc etc and the number of blocks made this year from the book, that come next year during history month, the subject will be very actively used in teaching about slave history.
Holice Turnbow
Designer, Teacher, Quilt Judge http://www.quiltingstencils.com
Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 23:37:16 -0800 | From: “Christine Thresh” <christine@>
February is Black History Month.
Christine Thresh http://www.winnowing.com/
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 06:18:42 -0500 | From: Judy White <jawhite@>
I just had an epiphany this afternoon which I am going to share with you.
This morning in the Hartford Courant, there was a two-page spread complete with pictures (the same ones from the book) about Hidden in Plain View.
Dr.
Dobard gave a talk last Thursday down in Madison at a bookstore about his book. Anyway, Edjonetta Miller, an African American textile artist who works out of the Artist’s Collective in Hartford, validated everything that was said in the book, and said she felt it was a very scholarly book. She agreed with the conclusions in the book. Her GGG grandmother was a slave and she said there are stories handed down in her family re these patterns and other things that are the that book. Also, several other African American artists also said the same thing as Edjonetta Miller.
So, I have come to the realization that the underground railroad wasn’t about us (white people). We, I think beginning with the Quakers, were only the facilitators, not the escapers. If African Americans say the book is true, what’s it to us on the Quilt History list? Why are we getting so upset over the book? If descendants of slaves agree with the book, who are we to argue?
And now, I’ll get off my soapbox.
Judy White – Ct
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 07:47:22 EST | From: @aol.com
In a message dated 2/22/00 61708 AM Eastern Standard Time, jawhite@ writes
<< Why are we getting so upset over the book? If descendants of slaves agree with the book, who are we to argue? >>
By this reasoning, if I, as a Welsh-American, wrote a book insisting that the first Europeans in America were Prince Madoc and his sailors, no one who was not Welsh would have the right to complain and point out the obvious lack of evidence, either written or archaeological.
This is ridiculous. The authors of HIPV wrote a book with very little evidence to support their hypothesis, with some of the evidence cited being patently absurd (slaves stealing compasses without being noticed? About as likely as someone stealing a laptop today). Merely by having it published, they have opened themselves to critique *from anyone who reads it*, not simply African-Americans.
Maybe there was a slave code in Southern quilting. Maybe there wasn’t.
I’d like to see something a little more contemporary than someone repeating a story that her great-great-grandmother passed down…..
Karen Evans
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 08:01:00 EST | From: Midnitelaptop@
i’m tired of all the bickering…i’m going to unsubscribe for a few months..will come back in May…and see if this “I’m right and your wrong”
nonsense is still going on.
bye for now
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 08:36:52 -0600 | From: Laura Hobby Syler <texas_quilt.co@>
Lynn,
From: a former first grade teacher…and I know there are many more still in teaching on line here…..go to the Principal…….
Go armed with as much information to the contrary as you can. Who can argue with “facts” vs “hearsay”……..Good topic for English, Debate, US History classes, btw
If he/she is not willing to listen then we are fighting an uphill battle.
Laura
At 1018 PM 02/21/2000 EST, Palampore@ wrote
>My daughter came home today and said that they had 2 black teachers talk
to
>the entire 3rd grade (80+ children) about “those” quilts today as part of Black History Month. I had already told her about how I disagreed with
this
>last year when they were told that the quilts were used as signs for the UGRR. I asked her what did they do? She said that they brought quilts
made
>by their mothers and said that those were some of the patterns were used
by
>the UGRR. (This has now been done in her entire school for 2 years.) I
asked
>her if she spoke up and told them her mother’s opinion. She said, “No, I couldn’t. I would have been embarassed.”
>I want desperately to say something, but I don’t know how to do this and
not
>start a battle. It angers me when history is treated this way and is
accepted.
>Would appreciate private emails regarding this. Don’t want to get another war going on this site.
>Thanks, Lynn Lancaster Gorges, New Bern, NC
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 09:55:57 -0500 | From: “sue reich” <mreich@>
In our state of Connecticut, we now have the Freedom Trail well plotted out. You can visit a fraction of the hundreds and hundreds of sites that served as links on the underground railroad. That list is continually being added to as more and more sites are identified. They are homes, schools, churches, etc. owned by “white folk” in the 19th c. In New England, they are every where, across the street, next store and where you work. Many of the families, then who participated were also Quakers, members of the 19th c New England communities but also a community within themselves. And yet the stories of the quilts as signs and symbols are not known here.
Those of you who have studied and or believe strongly in oral tradition especially when it exists within minorities with roots to tribal, African customs or within religious communities such as The Quakers, must speak up. =20
As a documenter with The Connecticut Quilt Search Project, we have been told many stories that have been handed down through generations of family members. These stories woven around the quilts are so believed to the families that often the inheritor of the quilt is restricted by the story attached to it. As a researcher, in the now 21st c, we struggle to validate these stories. And we can’t. This is because the web is so tight or was so secretive for such a long time with meaning and value to that family only. It just doesn’t make sense to us, with our 21st c eyes, many generations later. =20
Haven’t other documentation projects had this similar experience? So what do you do with these quilts and their stories? Careful. I know that oral tradition has been addressed here in the past. Help us out here. Those of you with the academic background and the expertise to defend any quilt stories passed through the generations.
=20
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 09:04:27 -0600 | From: Laura Hobby Syler <texas_quilt.co@>
First, let me say my spell checker is not cooperating so please forgive any typos’ I’ve not caught……..
Now, let me say that really makes me sad when we cant keep an open mind for discussion. I have not seen any bickering on this list in reference to “that book” or to the subject matter. What has been discussed, in what I have perceived as a very adult, professional manner, by many of the professional quilt historians on this list is the discrepancies in what “we” as “quilt historians” know to be true compared to those who study african/slave history and the assumed corrilations. I think the main problem that most of us have with the book is the way the information was “fed” to the co-author, and the fact that no antique quilts were used as illustrations. The section in the book that explains the African Art motifs is indeed very interesting. Were I once again in an art history class, it would be most helpful. However, it looks like the “non-quilt” world has taken this mis-information to heart……all we can do is politely remind them that there is no concrete (or cotton) basis for this theory…..and that many a romantic family tale has been mistaken for historical fact…………..
Laura in cloudy, hopefully soon to be rainy N. Texas
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 10:20:55 EST | From: Palampore@
1) The lady who did want to sell the insane asylum now doesn’t. It was made in an asylum in Central Islip, NY in the 1940’s. It was in pastels. Had a center medallion in an oval shape with pastel flowers within it. The outer border was a swag with flowers. Ironically I think I saw a similar one this weekend at an antique place. Wonder if it was a kit???? I will try to look in 20th century books to see if I see one like it.
2) My husband and I are setting up a show this week of things made by his 89 yr. old mother to celebrate her life. (Her 89th birthday is Thurs.) We went yesterday to get things for it. I have never seen so much fabric in my life!!!!! We are putting in pillows, stools made of cans, crocheted afghans, quilt tops, finished quilts, crocheted lace, crocheted rugs, punched rugs, etc. She loves bright bright colors. Should be wild!!! She was excited when we told her what we were doing. We will keep it up for a month. Will invite her family, friends, and our friends for private viewings. Would love to have it available to the public but it would require hiring another employee to stay with it.
We are putting together a cookbook in honor of my mother who turns 76 the following day.
3) I found a pattern yesterday in my things which is a McCall Pattern for a Ladies Five-Gored Short Petticoat. On it they have “established 1870”.
So, that gives a date for McCall Patterns.
4) We have a fabulous 12 year old cat. We found out yesterday that she has a tumor on her belly. They want to operate. We are uncertain if we want to put her through surgery. If any of you cat folks have had experience with this I would appreciate a private email. palampore@
Must head out to begin the set up of our show.
Lynn Lancaster Gorges, New Bern, NC
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 10:41:48 -0500 | From: “John and Tracey Winbigler” <twinbig@> (by way of List
way of List
Mom
I just wanted to add a tiny bit to this interesting discussion. A couple years ago, I went to a tiny quilt exhibit at the local arts center and was struck enraptured by a Double Wedding Ring made at the McDonough County, IL county hospital. It was comprised of 120 perfectly circular rings, set 10 by
12, and the arcs had sections approx. 1/2 inch. (Of course, the museum curator said she thought she knew why they were in the asylum–making that quilt.)
So I’m making a 100 ring copy by hand. I’ve been at it a year now, and have the first row finished. I joke that it will be the wedding quilt for each of my five children. They can use it on their wedding night, but then it returns to me….
Tracey Winbigler
Monmouth, IL
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 08:14:51 -0800 | From: “Mindy Sharp” <minsha@>
Do quilters on the average live longer than others?
As I was looking through Nebraska Quilts and Quiltmakers, it seemed that many of the featured quilters born in the early-late 1800’s lived to be 80-90 years ago. This would be far longer than the average life expectancy of women born in the 1800’s. Is there research on this subject?
Mindy Sharp
When life gives you scraps, make a quilt
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 12:04:05 -0500 (EST) | From: quiltsnbears@ (Textile Historian)
I did my psychology internship (1957) in a “mental institution” for 6 monhs and my sense of humor has been warped ever since here’s a point to ponder did the ladies quilt because they were in the asylum or were they in the asylum because they quilted? <wink>
Roberta
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 15:08:36 -0500 | From: “Jan Drechsler” <quiltdoc@>
A long time ago I was examining an Amish wool quilt at an exhibit and remarking how the blacks and colors were so vibrant and unfaded. A quilt shop owner told me that wool didn’t fade as did cotton. Perhaps some of the aniline dyes in certain colors were more light fast. What do our QHL Amish experts say? And has anyone noticed Amish wool quilts in general being more lightfast in one time period than another that might be due to to advances (or retreats) in the dye industry?
Jan Drechsler in Vermont
Quilt Restoration; Quilting teacher http://ourworld.@/homepages/bobmills/jan.html
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 14:44:45 -0600 | From: “Carol Butzke” <butzke@>
As you all have feared the “story” of Hidden from Plain View is spreading like wild fire. The Public Broadcasting System in Milwaukee Wisconsin in one of its locally produced programs call Black Nouveau had an African-American woman, whose introduction I missed, talk about quilts and the underground railroad. As you have already imagined, it was almost word for word from Hidden from Plain View including the sample blocks. =20
Thanks for all the wonderful information that comes along this list for this newbie.
Carol Butzke
In Wisconsin, were it is 48 degrees and all our beautiful snow is melting.
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 19:38:07 EST | From: Qltldy10@
In a message dated 2/22/00 83212 AM Pacific Standard Time, minsha@ writes
<< As I was looking through Nebraska Quilts and Quiltmakers, it seemed that many of the featured quilters born in the early-late 1800’s lived to be 80-90 years ago. This would be far longer than the average life expectancy of women born in the 1800’s. Is there research on this subject? >>
Mindy,
‘Life expectancy’ is impacted by the infant death rate. Life expectancy was so much lower in the late 19th and early 20th century because of the high rates of infant (infant is birth to one year, and includes neonatal, neonatal is birth to 28 days). The higher the rates of infant death, the lower the average life expectancy. I don’t know much about the older end of the life span, but there must be facts somewhere about duration of life once you get to, say, 65. I’d venture a guess that in 1900, if you got to say, 50, there is/was a much higher percentage chance that you’d get to 80. I know I’ve seen data for recent years that gives such facts. I get such facts from the
CDC’s MMWR (mortality and morbidity weekly review) at www.cdc.gov. I think I’ve also seen somewhere that people who have
‘hobbies/enthusiasm/hope live longer. Knitters have research on hormones to back up their claims that ‘this makes me feel better/calmer/etc’.
Beth in Maine
Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 23:00:45 EST | From: Kathi2174@
Hi,
Someone recently asked the list about burly fabric. I just received a flyer for The Textile History Forum in Cooperstown, NY, July 7 & 8, 2000. I am not connected to them, but noticed that one of the speakers, Linda Welters, Univ.
of RI, is presenting a paper titled “Burly Powerloom Fabrics in Rhode Island
Quilts.” Perhaps the person with the question on burly may find an answer here. Contact person is Rabbit Goody.
All the topics look fascinating! I wish I could go.
Kathi, between rainstorms in So. Calif.
