July 27 - July 30, 1997

Oral History & Documentation, Quilt Dating, Restoration & Conservation

These restored messages come from the Quilt History List, an online forum where quilt historians, collectors, researchers, appraisers, and enthusiasts discussed antique quilts and related textiles. The archive dates from 1996 through approximately 2016 and is being restored gradually. Sign up in the form at the bottom of the page if you want to know when a new page is added. Original spelling, opinions, formatting, and inactive links may remain unchanged.

Primary topics of this QHL Digest:

The Log Cabin “Black Center” Underground Railroad Legend — A long-running debate over whether black-centered Log Cabin blocks really marked safe houses, with members hunting for primary sources. (see the article on Underground Railroad quilts)
Primary vs. Secondary Sources in Quilt Folklore — A member lays out how to weigh oral family stories against documented evidence when evaluating quilt-history claims. (see the article on quilt folklore)
Visiting Museum Quilt Collections — Questions and answers about seeing quilts on display at the Smithsonian and the DAR Museum. (see the article on quilt museums)
Dating Fabric and Construction Details — A metallic-thread dating question and a curious quilt-within-a-quilt find from an antique shop. (see the article on dating quilts)

Date: Sun, 27 Jul 1997 22:38:39 -0400 (EDT) | From: Quilt97 [at] aol [dot] com

<< Dear QHL, As Penny as posted question on list will reply here, in case
there are others who are interested. I had never heard THAT particular
romantic myth before. The red center for the “hearth” fire, yes .. but
yellow, brown, green, and blue … nope, new to me.

The one featured (from Museum of American Folk Art) in Houck’s THE QUILT
ENCYCLOPEDIA ILLUSTRATED has black center squares. Guess the fire has
“burned out”! :>) >>

No the fire has not burned out! In fact safe houses of the Underground
Railroad displayed these quilts during the Civil War so escaping slaves knew
where it was safe to stay.

Winnie
>>

Winnie, I have heard of quilts being used to designate “safe houses,” but
never have found proof of it. Can you explain more, please?

Thanks.
Elisabeth

Date: Sun, 27 Jul 1997 19:38:24 -0700 | From: nikdeb [at] juno [dot] com (Nick R Hofland)

As you say, myths have a funny way of taking on a life of their own as
the years roll by.

This whole thread concerning the traditional colors behind log cabin
centers (I’ve heard black, red, and yellow on QHL within the last 2
months) and the colors of the succeeding strips, reminds me of my
college literature classes! REALLY! We would read an assigned
literature selection then answer some questions. I loved reading the
story, savoring the words and the images conjured up by the author. I
could easily come up with answers to the factual questions, but I
despised the ones that went like: “What did Shakespeare mean in x-y-z
where he writes such and such?” HELLO?

Later on when I took creative writing I realized that if I ever became a
renowned author (I should be so lucky!), some poor college or high school
student could someday be stuck picking apart my words…..! What if I
meant exactly what I wrote? The poor English teachers would be out of
work?!

Quilts are a lot like writing or reading literature. Our “words” are
fabric and thread. Sometimes we mean just what we “write”, sometimes
we write a mystery, and other times we follow tradition. Whether we
select traditionally accepted colors for a particular pattern, or strike
off on our own–because we like a color or want something to “go with”
something else–future generations (like the high school literature
students) may STILL be left wondering what we meant by a color .

Another thing that figures in this equation, is that each person who
views a quilt brings their own history and feelings with them. We
might be trying to impart a particular feeling with our quilt, yet a
viewer who hates “pink” will not see the beauty in the pattern, like
someone who loves that colork!

Penny’s definitions of the meanings of a Log Cabin Quilt Pattern seem no
more far-fetched than any other definitions I’ve heard of or read about
concerning other quilt patterns. To me, her definitions make perfect
sense and probably there were one or two pioneer women who thought of
those very same meanings. Art mimics life. And if someone else has
another definition that makes sense, I’ll probably like that one too!
(I’m so easy to get along with! This is why I didn’t do well on those
English Lit. questions!)

Well, definitely spent more than my two-cents’ worth, but I haven’t waxed
loquacious for quite some time. (flexing my fingers!) Whew. Don’t
mean to offend any English teachers out in the audience either!

Deb in Spokane
land of perfect summer temps: 80’s and NO humidity!

Date: Sun, 27 Jul 1997 22:06:41 -0500 | From: LAURA SYLER <texas_quilt.co [at] airmail [dot] net>

>
> As you say, myths have a funny way of taking on a life of their own as
> the years roll by.
>
> This whole thread concerning the traditional colors behind log cabin
> centers (I’ve heard black, red, and yellow on QHL within the last 2
> months) and the colors of the succeeding strips, reminds me of my
> college literature classes! REALLY! We would read an assigned
> literature selection then answer some questions. I loved reading the
> story, savoring the words and the images conjured up by the author. I
> could easily come up with answers to the factual questions, but I
> despised the ones that went like: “What did Shakespeare mean in x-y-z
> where he writes such and such?” HELLO?
>
> Later on when I took creative writing I realized that if I ever became a
> renowned author (I should be so lucky!), some poor college or high school
> student could someday be stuck picking apart my words…..! What if I
> meant exactly what I wrote? The poor English teachers would be out of
> work?!
>
> Quilts are a lot like writing or reading literature. Our “words” are
> fabric and thread. Sometimes we mean just what we “write”, sometimes
> we write a mystery, and other times we follow tradition. Whether we
> select traditionally accepted colors for a particular pattern, or strike
> off on our own–because we like a color or want something to “go with”
> something else–future generations (like the high school literature
> students) may STILL be left wondering what we meant by a color .
>
> Another thing that figures in this equation, is that each person who
> views a quilt brings their own history and feelings with them. We
> might be trying to impart a particular feeling with our quilt, yet a
> viewer who hates “pink” will not see the beauty in the pattern, like
> someone who loves that colork!
>
> Penny’s definitions of the meanings of a Log Cabin Quilt Pattern seem no
> more far-fetched than any other definitions I’ve heard of or read about
> concerning other quilt patterns. To me, her definitions make perfect
> sense and probably there were one or two pioneer women who thought of
> those very same meanings. Art mimics life. And if someone else has
> another definition that makes sense, I’ll probably like that one too!
> (I’m so easy to get along with! This is why I didn’t do well on those
> English Lit. questions!)
>
> Well, definitely spent more than my two-cents’ worth, but I haven’t waxed
> loquacious for quite some time. (flexing my fingers!) Whew. Don’t
> mean to offend any English teachers out in the audience either!
>
> Deb in Spokane
> land of perfect summer temps: 80’s and NO humidity!
>

From an English lit/Elem ed/Art major (don’t ask!!)

Here!!Here!! Very well put!!!
Laura

Date: Sun, 27 Jul 1997 20:54:53 -0700 | From: Nancy Cameron Armstrong <narmstr [at] ibm [dot] net>

Dear Winnie and QHL,

The quilt with the black centers to which I referrred [see GLORIOUS
AMERICAN QUILTS: THE QUILT COLLECTION OF THE MAFA, pages 68 and 71] was
made by Sara Olmstead King in Connecticut 1875-1885, so THAT one surely
was not made for a “safe house” on the Underground Railroad. I would
welcome a citation to the information about the display of these quilts
with black centers. It is a story I do recall having heard or read
before [perhaps on QHL], but have not come across in “the literature.”
There seem to be several of us who have interest in this topic, and
expect others would also like to be able to read more about the use of
Log Cabin quilts for this special purpose.
Thanks, nca
Thanks, nca

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 07:20:20 -0400 (EDT) | From: Qltldy10 [at] aol [dot] com

For nca and all- seems to me some formal research is in order. Someone
needs to catalog all the black (or maybe non-red) center log cabins, attempt
to “date” them, and see how many were made when. I saw one at Maine Quilts
’97 with a black mill engraving as the center block, probably circa 1910 or
so. Did all of the Victorian black centers come about because of the
increase in black centers during the Cival War years? Was there really an
increase during the years before the cival war? How about this?… how many
stops on the underground railroad are documented. 3? 30? 300? When did it
operate? Could this have a bearing on our question? How about where they
were made? Knowing, of course, how they can travel, if the Ohio Amish have
the greatest number of black center log cabins, then my brain takes a
different thought track than if they seem to have arisen in the south in the
mid 18oo’s. Then, for the hisotrians, the question would be is there any
written diary documentation? Has anyone read all of Harriet Tubmans memoirs?
Funding for this project? Hmm- a museum or university, a nonprofit hsitory
group, the Smithsonian?? You know, seems to me that this would be a great
piece of american history, certainly women’s history, if it’s true. If it’s
true in only one case, then it’s a great story. I see a movie here…..
Beth in Maine

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 07:45:07 -0400 (EDT) | From: Kittencat3 [at] aol [dot] com

Here’s the information on Hardwick Hall you wanted:

Hardwick Hall may be contacted at the following address:

Doe Lea
Chesterfield S44 5QJ
Derbyshire
Tel: (01246) 850430

http://www.openworld.co.uk/britain/pages/H/HAR45QJa.html
If you have questions, email: enquiries [at] openworld [dot] co [dot] uk or call: +44 (0)1225
444950. The Web page includes a map. Hardwick Hall was built by Elizabeth,
Countess of Shrewsbury, and is near another of her famous houses, Chatsworth
House.

Good luck!

Lisa Evans
Springfield, MA

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 97 09:31:06 EDT | From: tijc02!stefds [at] uunet [dot] uu [dot] net (Debra Steffey)

I’m going to the Smithsonian next week, which
building am I mostly like to see some of the quilts
they have. Do you have to make private arrangements
to see the collections or do they allow that?
Need some clues
Debby Steffey
dss227%tijc02 [at] uunet [dot] uu [dot] net

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 09:49:33, -0500 | From: LVQG24A [at] prodigy [dot] com ( ELIZABETH K DONALDSON)

Where do all these myths originate. The answer for many is easy.
Stories sell. Many of the stories were made up by people in the
business of selling patterns. During quilt revivals of the 1890’s-
1920’s, companies were selling more patterns and less patterns were
being traded. Writing copy to sell the patterns got more creative and
pattern stories and names were spun, some based on fact others just
made up. When researching pattern names and stories, we must remember
there is no “right or wrong”, just the stories as we discover them.
History is not one definitive answer, but many fascinating stories
interwoven or dare I say patched together! I just enjoy all the
stories and report them as acurately as I can as far as where and who
I got the story from. Once you get many stories, then you can piece
them together and make some educated guesses of your own to add to
the myths!

Beth in Lansing

Charm Quilts update. I’ve seen the color proofs of my book charm
quilts and they are stunning. You can literally pick the individual
fabrics right off the quilt. Look for this book in October.

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 10:31:50 -0400 (EDT) | From: HPQuilting [at] aol [dot] com

Deb:
Thanks for the vote of confidence. It reminds me of the story of a reporter
who decided that there was enormous symbolism in one of T.S. Elliot’s works.
His question to Elliot was “Mr. Elliot, what did you mean when you wrote,’
Outside was cold and dark and rainy’ ?” Elliot smiled and said, “I meant that
it was cold and dark and rainy outside.”

Thanks again.
Penny

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 12:45:53 -0800 | From: Deborah Hopkinson

Content-Disposition: inline

I have also tried to track actual documentation for black centers being
used to mark safe houses, and, I may have mentioned this before, spoke with
an African American quilt historian who would only say that “the legend is
strong.”

It may be that it can’t ever be proven, but it persists in the realm of
folklore. But it’s a wonderful image. I never could find actual written
documentation of escape routes being sewn into quilts. But I am glad that
I wrote Sweet Clara and the Freedom Quilt anyway, as teachers have used the
idea to have students make quilt maps of underground railroad routes, their
own routes to and from school, routes taken by various fleeing slaves, etc.

Deborah Hopkinson
(author, Sweet Clara and Birdie’s Lighthouse)
hopkinda [at] whitman [dot] edu

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 15:37:52 -0400 | From: quiltmag [at] mindspring [dot] com (Jean Ann Eitel)

Debby, you will see about half a dozen quilts (if that many) on display in
the Americana exhibits. Unfortunately their extensive quilt collection is
not available to the public at this time. They are presently trying to work
out a way to exhibit these quilts without causing further damage to the
already fragile textiles…

do call the DAR Museum. I think you will see more quilts there than at the
Smithsonian at this time.

Jean Ann Eitel, Editor
QUILT Magazines
http://www.quiltmag.com

#quilttalk internet IRC channel – #quilttalk activities home page…
http://www.quilttalk.com

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 16:10:30 -0400 (EDT) | From: Baglady111 [at] aol [dot] com

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 16:18:33 -0500 (CDT) | From: caveman [at] fastlane [dot] net

Hi all,
I also specifically remember reading about the black centers in log
cabin quilts as being markers for “safe houses” for the underground
railroad. The quilts were hung out on the clothes line as a message to
escaping slaves. I have sat back and read everyone’s ideas but see that no
one yet has found the documentation. I have DOZENS of quilt history books
and will start looking for this as I know I read it somewhere. I was
browsing through an AQS book “Arkansas Quilts” and it mentions the black
centers in Courthouse Steps quilts as representing the judge’s robes, page
94. I don’t remember ever seeing that before. It was also interesting to
read the introduction of the book written by then Govenor Bill Clinton who
praised Arkansans for preserving their artistic and cultural heritage.
I will get back to looking through my quilt history books to see what I
can find in reference to black centers. I hope the story I remember reading
was not in a magazine since I will never find it if that is the case!

Arlene in Texas

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 17:31:34 -0400 | From: “Judy Grow” <Judygrow [at] blast [dot] net>

Today in my browsing antique shops I saw a one patch quilt (3″ squares),
made in the thirties, tied, and obviously heavily used. It was pretty
inexpensive, so I looked more closely. A couple of the fabrics were worn
through, and I could see that inside, used as the filler, was another
quilt, quilted. But from what I could see that inner quilt was at least as
heavily worn out as the outer quilt, with batting showing, so I left it in
the store.

I was tempted, I must admit, to take apart the outer quilt and use the
fabrics for repair. I don’t know, the more I think about it, the more
tempting it becomes. Maybe tomorrow.

Thanks to all who responded to my post about the very brittle black and
white gingham in the antique quilt top I have just finished. I don’t know
about the buttermilk recipe. It is intriguing, so I have saved it. Maybe.
I know that when it hits water I’ll have to be super careful.

Now, which antique top will I tackle next? Will let you know when I make
up my mind.

I promised myself that except for gifts, the two years between October 96
and October 98 would be devoted to finishing antique tops. I won Viewer’s
Choice in my guild two show in a row with my own quilts (October 94 and
October 96) and I don’t want to make enemies if I don’t have to!
Judy in NJ
judygrow [at] blast [dot] net

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 18:05:31 -0400 | From: suewho [at] juno [dot] com (Susanne Ellenberger)

Nice idea. I hope Nancee saw it.

Susanne Ellenberger
One Stitch At A Time :>)

In Ohio

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 18:57:22 -0400 (EDT) | From: HPQuilting [at] aol [dot] com

Arlene:
Thanks so much for your interest and further research. It is greatly
appreciated. I live in a rather affluent neighborhood, due to the fact that
the Lord had mercy on me and I found a friend of a friend who lets us rent
this little blue country house at a bargain. I bring this up because quilting
is just taking hold in this particular area of Birmingham. I am trying to
educate my students in the priceless history that we own as women in our
quilting legacy. I am a passionate student of it myself. All of the folks in
our QHL group have meant so much to me in this. I really am indebted to you
all.

Penny(HPQuilting [at] aol [dot] com)

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 19:31:17 -0400 (EDT) | From: Baglady111 [at] aol [dot] com

In a message dated 97-07-28 18:12:25 EDT, you write:

<< I have DOZENS of quilt history books
and will start looking for this as I know I read it somewhere. I was
browsing through an AQS book “Arkansas Quilts” and it mentions the black
centers in Courthouse Steps quilts as representing the judge’s robes, page
94. I don’t remember ever seeing that >>

I use the story of the LOG CABIN and the black center for the judges robes,
representing law and order in pioneer days , in my lectures HOW QUILT
PATTERNS WERE NAMED..and altho there is no docuementation…and I don’t know
WHEN they began using/wearing black robes..it still makes an interesting
story..
If anyone thinks THIS pattern has alot of stoires connected to it..you should
do TEH DOUBLE WEDDING RING sometime..Jane of THE FEEDSACK CLUB..

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 20:05:09 -0400 (EDT) | From: QuiltFixer [at] aol [dot] com

Despite the difference of opinion on this subject, I really am enjoying the
interchange of information, myth or otherwise. Keep on sending it! We all
learn something I am sure!

Toni Baumgard
QuiltFixer [at] aol [dot] com

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 19:25:50 -0500 (CDT) | From: caveman [at] fastlane [dot] net

>Hello all,
> I have been through most of my books and did find one reference to the
black centers in log cabins. I doubt this is where I originally read it but
at least it is in print and I didn’t dream it! In the Rodale book “Log
Cabins”, managing editor Suzanne Nelson writes…..”a red center came to
symbolize the hearth of the home, and a yellow center represented a lantern
placed in the window as a welcoming beacon. During the Civil War, a Lob
Cabin quilt with black center squares hung on a clothesline was meant to
signal a safe haven for the Underground Railroad.” Suzanne does not list her
references but Rodale does invite questions. I will be happy to supply the
address if anyone is interested.

> On an un-log-cabin-related topic, I just finished piecing a one patch
quilt that I saw in the book “Hearts and Hands“. It is the one patch quilt
on page39 and the patches are arranged in dramatic diagonal bands of color.
The quilt pictured is c.1875-1900 and I pulled out all my reproduction
fabrics from the Smithsonian and Shelburne collections, the Hargrave
Heirloom collection, and all other reproduction fabrics of that approximate
time period to make my reproduction of this simple but gorgeous antique
quilt. I took my magnifying glass out to study the fabrics more closely in
the photo as I selected my fabrics. I am very happy with the result as I
think it closely resembles the original. The only exception is that there
was a very wide band of lights and beiges that I didn’t like as well, so I
added more color in that area. I have to wonder how the original quiltmaker
kept herself organized as she pieced all those little squares. Even using a
rotary cutter and a sewing machine, it still took me a long time and it was
hard to keep straight the order of the little squares as I pieced each row.
I have always admired those long ago quiltmakers and the difficulties they
might have had to overcome to piece the beautiful quilts they made.
>
> Arlene in Texas
>

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 20:21:26 -0400 (EDT) | From: JOCELYNM [at] delphi [dot] com

On 27-JUL-1997 13:03:14.2 WLEDU said to JOCELYNM
> No the fire has not burned out! In fact safe houses of the Underground
> Railroad displayed these quilts during the Civil War so escaping
>slaves knew where it was safe to stay.
Winnie,
We recently discussed this, and no one could find a definitive
reference on this. Several people had heard it, but no one knew of a
reference that could clearly document this practice. We couldn’t find anyone
who knew of a primary source on the practice (i.e., the personal writings of
a quiltmaker ‘conductress’ where she said ‘I made a Log Cabin quilt for this
reason’) or even a quilt where the family could document that the maker was
a ‘conductress’. If you have such a source, I’m sure there would be several
of us who’d like for you to post it.
You might find it interesting to read the old notes, as we debated
about how it might work, and why slavecatchers wouldn’t be able to see the
quilts just as well as the slaves!
Jocelyn

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 19:48:14 +0400 | From: Xenia Cord <xecord [at] netusa1 [dot] net>

Hi, All:

The discussions about the significance of different colored centers in
Log Cabin quilts is an interesting one. I’d just like to say that
finding a printed source that repeats one of these oral stories does not
necessarily validate it. How often have we seen printed sources saying
that cotton seeds (!) in the batting mean that the quilt was made before
the invention of the cotton gin, or that all early 19th century quilts
were salvage construction, made of fabrics cut from worn out clothing?
We know these ideas are incorrect, even though they are perpetuated in
print (don’t we?).

I have a beautiful Log Cabin from about the 1870s, Pennsylvania, in
which the centers are wonderful Prussian blue wool, and the remainder is
wool challis in dark green-black, and in wonderful paisleys and figured
wool dress prints. I think the quiltmaker, Mary Jane Neely, just liked
the contrast!

Xenia, in Indiana

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 20:55:36 -0400 | From: suewho [at] juno [dot] com (Susanne Ellenberger)

Nancee,
Bravo! You said it very nicely to Brenda. There have been some pretty
provative ideas presented from other DJ’ers. Have you seen them? So
glad you talked about the kindred spirit within us all. I wil still send
a check for whatever you decide to do. I trust your judgement. We are a
strong voice to be contended with.

Susanne Ellenberger
One Stitch At A Time :>)

In Ohio, where it is still muggy!

Date: Mon, 28 Jul 1997 22:10:44 -0400 | From: Ricki Maietta <rmaietta [at] csrlink [dot] net>

Hi – I want to thank everyone who responded to my search for powder blue
plain 1930s fabric! I had several responses & snippets are currently
working their way through snail mail in hopes of coming up with just the
right stuff. Thanks again, everyone.

Ricki

Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 10:09:39 -0400 (EDT) | From: JOCELYNM [at] delphi [dot] com

On 28-JUL-1997 20:47:41.0 xecord said to JOCELYNM
> Log Cabin quilts is an interesting one. I’d just like to say that
> finding a printed source that repeats one of these oral stories does
>not necessarily validate it. How often have we seen printed sources
Xenia,
This might be a good point to talk about primary vs. secondary sources.

A primary source, in this case, would be the diary of a quiltmaker,
where she wrote about why she chose a certain design and color.
A secondary source would be her descendents, who had ‘always heard’
that Grandma…..
A tertiary source would be someone ELSE reporting those family legends
in a book.
At any point in an art or craft, when it becomes romanticized, legends
get created wholesale. That’s why during Victorian England, tablet weaving
got attributed to the Egyptians rather than the Scandinavians and Germans,
who had it fully 600 years earlier! It’s also how, at the same time,
Scottish tartan patterns got designated as ‘clan’ tartans (prior to this,
they were actually REGIONAL tartans…..patterns spread geographically from
one clan to an adjacent one) or how the legend that Aryan knitters knitted
‘family’ patterns so that the bodies of dead fishermen could be identified
(ugh! While I don’t doubt that there were some identifications made from the
pattern of the sweater, can you really imagine that a woman would knit the
exact same sweater, decade after decade, for all of her menfolk?)
Quilting has certainly been romanticized over the years. After all….
look at how many people say that their GRANDMOTHER was a quilter! I’ve read
this back in primary sources any number of times. Now, we think of quilting
as being a grandmotherly thing to do…but that was true of OUR
grandmothers, and THEIR grandmothers…..each successive generation labeling
it as that old-fashioned thing that Grandma did. I find it really impossible
to believe that for over 100 years, quilting has skipped a generation
consistently!
Jocelyn

Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 14:21:32 -0400 (EDT) | From: HPQuilting [at] aol [dot] com

In a message dated 97-07-28 22:21:44 EDT, you write:

<< On an un-log-cabin-related topic, I just finished piecing a one patch
quilt that I saw in the book “Hearts and Hands”. It is the one patch quilt
on page39 and the patches are arranged in dramatic diagonal bands of color.
The quilt pictured is c.1875-1900 and I pulled out all my reproduction
fabrics from the Smithsonian and Shelburne collections, the Hargrave
Heirloom collection, and all other reproduction fabrics of that approximate
time period to make my reproduction of this simple but gorgeous antique
quilt. I took my magnifying glass out to study the fabrics more closely in
the photo as I selected my fabrics. I am very happy with the result as I
think it closely resembles the original. The only exception is that there
was a very wide band of lights and beiges that I didn’t like as well, so I
added more color in that area. I have to wonder how the original quiltmaker
kept herself organized as she pieced all those little squares. Even using a
rotary cutter and a sewing machine, it still took me a long time and it was
hard to keep straight the order of the little squares as I pieced each row.
I have always admired those long ago quiltmakers and the difficulties they
might have had to overcome to piece the beautiful quilts they made.
>
> Arlene in Texas
>

>>
I would love to have Suzanne Nelson’s address to inquire further into her
sources for the documentation of the black square in the Underground Railroad
quilts. Thanks for sharing your info!

Penny(HPQuilting [at] aol [dot] com)

Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 14:20:10 -0400 (EDT) | From: HPQuilting [at] aol [dot] com

Thanks so much for the info on historical sources!
Maybe I can make you feel better about this grandmother thing. My maternal
grandmother would have cut her wrists if she had to do handwork. She never
quilted, crocheted, knitted, etc. She was a fabulous seamstress and cook,
however.
My paternal granny made a few quilts, but (just between us) they were
hideous. She tatted and crocheted mostly. She taught herself, and her work
was exquisite. I think that she associated quilts with the extreme poverty
she’s escaped when she married my grandfather.
My mother never made a homemade cookie and never sewed (she was still a
dynamite mother). I do all of the above except tatting (which I would love to
learn). One reason I wanted to learn to quilt was the fact that no one else
in my family group had ever done it before, so it was shrouded in mystique,
and, therefore, a challenge.

Thanks again,
Penny(HPQuilting [at] aol [dot] com)

Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 15:25:02 -0400 (EDT) | From: AMDOODAH [at] aol [dot] com

Sorry, I know this isn’t quilt related but at least it involves SEWING. I
have a client request (she sounded desperate) for a needle to make a type of
shirred rug.
She says it looks like a sharp knitting needle with a crochet hook on one
end. They make a new aluminum one in Branson, Mo. but it bends and won’t
stay sharp. She needs an old one of steel or brass, she remembers her
Grandmother making these rugs and sharpening the end by rubbing it on a rock.
Apparently, the shirred fabric is held together and joined to other strips
with a crochet stitch. I’ve seen old shirred rugs before but had no idea how
it was done. Anyway, if anyone can help – e-mail me privately at
AMDOODAH [at] aol [dot] com. Thanks – Joan

Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 16:20:36 +0000 | From: “Rosemary Teghtmeyer” <rsmeyer [at] cmc [dot] net>

On 27 Jul 97 at 18:55, QHL-Digest-request [at] cue [dot] com wrote:

> Date: Sun, 27 Jul 1997 03:14:10 -0700
> From: Nancy Cameron Armstrong
> Subject: QHL: Log Cabin colors
> Dear QHL,
(snip)
> The one featured (from Museum of American Folk Art) in Houck’s THE QUILT
> ENCYCLOPEDIA ILLUSTRATED has black center squares. Guess the fire has
> “burned out”! :>) Do WONDER where all these myths begin. Would like to
> have a compendium of all these lovely, romantic, and often far-fetched
> “explanations” for significance of names, colors, sets, etc., etc.
>

Hi All,
I’ve been a member of this list for a few months and have enjoyed
reading all the messages.

The Log Cabin being one of my favorite quilt patterns. I would love
to see a picture of the log cabin with black center squares. As
written in “American Heritage Quilts” copywrite 1991 says ” A few Log
Cabin quilts of the Civil War era that have black centers were hung
on the clothesline to subtly advertise a station of hte Underground
Railroad. “

I didn’t know if this was a tale repeated for generations or if
anyone had actually seen one. Fantastic.

This book also says that the Log Cabin block dates from the 1860
presidential campaign of Abraham Lincolin whose origins were
represented by the log cabin of his birth. Yellow centers symbolize
candles in the cabin window and red represents the hearth.

Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 20:20:36, -0500 | From:

I was looking at 3 quilt tops given to me by my grandmother. Her
mother pieced the tops and my grandmother thinks that all were done
prior to 1938. Many of the pieces are feedsacks, but there is one
fabric that looks out of place to me. It is a “pajama print” of
white and soft pink stripes. On the white stripes there are thin
stripes of metallic gold thread. Does anyone know when metallic
thread was first used in fabric? I would greatly appreciate any
information. TIA, Tiffany Regan

Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 20:02:49 -0500 (CDT) | From: caveman [at] fastlane [dot] net

Hi Penny,
You asked for Suzanne Nelson’s address so you can inquire about her
source of log cabin information. Suzanne is (or was in 1994) managing editor
for “The Classic American Quilt Collection–Log Cabin”. Rodale Press invites
any questions or comments on their book. The address is: Rodale Press, Inc.
Book Readers’ Service
33 East Minor Street
Emmaus, PA 18098

I will be interested in hearing what you find out. Good luck!

Arlene in Texas

Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 20:58:10 -0400 (EDT) | From: ROM1026 [at] aol [dot] com

Some how I must have been booted off the list ;>)
Please add me back on
ROM1026 [at] aol [dot] com

thanks
pat in nj

Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 20:24:54 -0500 (CDT) | From: caveman [at] fastlane [dot] net

At 07:47 AM 7/29/97 EDT, you wrote:
>Hello Arleen

I have noticed your e-mail address. I presume from it you, your
>husband or both of you are cavers.
>

I have done a little caving, but in no way consider myself a
>caver.
>

I am in central PA and attend the MAR and OTR. I am a member of
>NSS, but have never been to convention.
>

Please tell me a little more about yourself.
>Joan Brown
>sew much to do, sew little time
>
Hello Joan,
Yes, you’re right, we are cavers and love to go caving several times a
year. There aren’t many caves in this part of Tx but last week-end, my DH
went to Arkansas with friends and spent 10 hours in a wild and beautiful
cave. I have mud encrusted clothes on the porch to remind me! I stayed home
and took a little excursion to the historic town of Weatherford to visit 2
quilt shops that I had never been to before. One shop, Grandma Lynn’s
Quilts, was truly wonderful. It is located just off the town square and
resides in the oldest brick house in the town. The house is over 130 yrs
old, has 12 foot ceilings, and is crammed ceiling to floor with beautiful
fabrics, notions, samples, you name it. I highly recommend this shop and
it’s most gracious owner. It was such a pleasure to visit her shop and hear
the history of her store. Truly fascinating to hear of all the occupants of
the house since the Civil War. Again, you must visit this shop if you are
ever in Weatherford!
It’s good to hear from another quilter/caver. I know a few but there
aren’t many of us! Happy quilting/caving, Arlene in Texas

Date: Tue, 29 Jul 1997 21:32:37 -0400 (EDT) | From: AJSNGS [at] aol [dot] com

Hi all,

I’m wondering if any of you have looked at or read the book The Careless
Quilter? I’ve seen it listed on Kris’ books for sale, but I didn’t see a
review of it. Anyone who is familiar with this book can e-mail me privately,
or to the list if you think it would benefit others.

Thanks!

Nancy Sentipal in Virginia
AJSNGS [at] aol [dot] com

Date: Tue, 29 Jul 97 22:54:33 PDT | From: John & Cinda Cawley <cawley [at] epix [dot] net>

OK, Xenia! The world is not orderly; neither is quiltmaking. Our
foremothers in fabric had few rules. I think that most of the stories
(significance of the red center, for instance) are later impositions. The
women who made the quilts based their design decisions on what they had
available and what they liked. There are no simple explanations.
Cinda in Scranton

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 03:41:06 -0400 (EDT) | From: HPQuilting [at] aol [dot] com

Arlene:
Thanks so much for your promptness with that address. I’ll let you know what
I find out.

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 07:27:48 -0400 (EDT)

Does anyone have a copy of Barbara Brackman’s paper in ‘UNCOVERINGS, 1992″
available from AQSG?? Jane of THE FEEDSACK CLUB

Many thanks from a confused quilter!

Nancy Sentipal in VA

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 09:35:11 -0400 (EDT)
Hi,
I have a question, actually two, regarding several quilt blocks I purchased
at an estate auction a while back.
First, the blocks are 8 in. square, nine patch blocks as pictured in Clues
on pg. 83, only the center patch is a nine patch block also. The fabrics are
navy w/wihte pin dots or white stars, white background w/red and black
triangles, and the long side pieces are white background w/red stars in
snake like lines and words in black letters. The words are: Mayflower, New
Orleans, Foote, SanFrancisco, Montgomery, Nashville, Oregon Olympis,
Minneapolis, Philadelphia, Columbia, Baltimore, Iowa, Puritan, New York,
Boston, Terror, Massachusetts, Marblehead, Amphitrite, Cincinnati, Detroit,
Texas, Philadelphia, Indiana, and Brooklyn. There may be more words, but
you get the idea. The blocks are hand and machine pieced, very good
condition, and there are 26 in all.
The second set of blocks (16) are the same nine patch with some of the same
navy pindot but with a white background w/ black prints for the long outside
patches (all the same)and the center nine patch. Twelve of the blocks have
cadet blue and white w/black pindot center nine patches.
Question one: Can any one give me a date on the fabric, especially the one
with the names?
Question two: Should I leave these as is or should I make them into quilts
and IF I would finish them how would they have been set together?
TIA to everyone for the help.
Sue in cool sunny Northwest Ohio

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 09:49:04 -0400
From: “Barb Burke”

I just resubscribed for the regular version and I’m getting Digests which
have the messages along with them. I’m confused. I received three digests
from Annette Gero. This seems different from the other time I was on the
list. Thank you so much for any enlightenment. I hope that I don’t sound
like I’m whinning…I really feel pretty good this am!!! Good but
confused!
Peace,Piece,
Barb

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 11:34:21 -0400 (EDT)
Tiffany:
When I was 10 years old, sewing and quilting in 1936 (in Texas and old
enough to remember fabrics), I never saw any metallic threads–not even on
the 25-cents-a-yard table (I think this must have been satins, silks and
velvets. [Mother limited me to the 3 1/2 cent (percales) to the 7 cent
(demity, voiles) a yard tables!] However, starting in the mid fifties and
into the late sixties, there was quite a bit of plaid and striped fabric with
a metallic thread. I’m still quilting with it. One I have is a stripe
similar to mattress ticking in pattern, with stripes of blue, green and pink
on white, each stripe having a metallic thread–gold, I think, but I’d have
to check.
Maybe someone “filled out” a few squares of an old top with a more
modern print and quilted it later, as I am doing on my mothers old quilt tops
of the thirties. Wish that lady had of figured in 1/4 inch hems! As it is,
I think I’ll have to go into the pattern to set the squares together.
Willa Dean Reynolds
Soquel, CA

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 09:56:50 -0600
From: “Brian Potter & Family”

Hi!
I have just re-subscribed to QHL and have enjoyed the thread on the log
cabins – one of my favorite patterns.
I thought I’d let you know that I have been quilting off and on since 1984
but seriously since 1993. I don’t have anyone else in my family or
extended family that quilts – which is why I got into it actually. No
Grandma quilts to pass on or learn from! Sad in a way. I envy all those
who do have their Grandmas or great-grandmas quilts to love. I am hoping
that my children and their children will love mine as much as I would love
my grand/grandmas quilts if I had them!
Dale Anne

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 11:19:26 -0500
From: (Brenda Groelz)
Jane writes: “I think it is sad that those who
cannot accept anything BUT docuemented miss alot”

I agree with you Jane, that we would all be poorer for not hearing the
myths that surround our quiltmaking traditions. They enrich us all.

But, I feel it is VERY important that when passing along these stories, we
are careful to present them for what they are. Stories. Myths.
Folktales. Not facts.

Relating this to your favored feedsacks, let’s remember what the feedsack
collectors tell people. “Feedsack type fabric was produced as yardage and
was available on bolts during the same time that feedsacks were prevalent.
You can not say a piece of fabric found in a quilt was definitely feedsack
unless you can spot the telltale holes from the bag’s stitching, or perhaps
the inked label on the sack.” In other words, “prove it”.

We love to tell the stories, but I feel they should be introduced with the
words, “Now, here is a lovely tale that some people feel explains the
reason for using this color in the center….” or “A story passed through
the generations says…..but no documented source has ever been found.”

It’s not fair to the general public to perpetuate the myths without
explaining that we have no confirmation of these stories as fact. A
preface to a book that stated this would be a great help. I am bothered by
the quilt-themed books aimed at children that re-tell the myths without
explaining that we can’t prove them. Children read these stories, believe
them, and grow to be adults who “KNOW that such and such is true”.

Deborah Hopkinson, who wrote “Sweet Clara’s Freedom Quilt” posted here
earlier about her own search for documentation of the use of quilts as
signals for Underground Railroad houses and escape routes. I don’t have my
copy of your book in front of me, Deborah, so I can’t check. But, did you
include a disclaimer in the book that told the reader that the story was
based on strong legend, which has so far been undocumented?

The same thing applies to the “intentional error” story that has been
perpetuated in print and conversation. Unless we know the quilter
personally and she tells us that she put that error in there intentionally,
I am inclined to believe that she either missed it or was too frustrated to
take it out a third time! To immediately label a mistake in a quilt as an
“intentional error” is misleading.

We can’t attribute something to a quilt unless we have information from the
maker. We don’t know why she “used the black in the center” or why she
“reversed those two triangles”. We can guess, and we can make up lovely
stories about how it may have happened, but we shouldn’t present them as
facts.

Brenda Groelz

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 12:47:11 -0400 (EDT)
One of my students inquired recently as to whether or not I had ever heard of
“mud dyeing” in the Appalachian region. She said that her grandmother told
her that they used to dig a hole in either red or yellow clay here in
Alabama. They would fill the hole with water, put in the fabric and leave it
there for one week to dye it. Then they’d cut it into shapes and quilt it. (I
suppose this would be a secondary source, historically speaking). I told her
that I would research it for her and that it was certainly possible for
several reasons:

You can never, ever get out a stain from either source. If you get it
on any fabric, the best you can hope for is to fade it slightly. I’m sure if
unbleached muslin were left in it for a week, the stain would be in for life.
It would have been a cheap, readily available way for poor folks to dye
homespun or muslin and have a bit of color for their quilts.
I am conducting some research on this. I have found a woman here who sells
T-shirts that have been mud dyed as Alabama mud T-shirts. You could not tell
that they had been dyed in anything but the usual way, except that they are
only buttercup yellow or terracotta color.
Any information on this? I am going to check out a collection of antique
quilts from common folk in Tuscaloosa next month and I will be looking for
evidence of this. The man who shows them is the grandson of the woman who
made them. He wrote and article in Quilt Digest a few years ago about her. I
am hoping to glean lots of good information from him.

Penny

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 16:09:17 -0400 (EDT)

Would like to hear from any and all who are going to the QRS meeting in Omaha
in September. Also from people who are attending Barbara B.’s fabric
indentification class right afterwards. Please E-mail me at

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 16:32:07 -0700
From: Lynn & Debbie CUPP

Recently I acquired a set of blocks in watermelon pink and green. It
had the extra fabric and the templates in the box. The templates were
cardboard and some magazine pages from 40’s or 50’s. I am not familiar
with this pattern. Does it ring a bell with anyone?? I’ve scanned it
and put it on my web page. Can anyone name it for me??

http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Plains/4280/astr.jpg

Thanks,
Debbie Cupp
Virginia

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 16:01:03 -0500 (CDT)
From: Cynthia A Wall
Subject: QHL: Black Centers

I have really enjoyed reading about these log cabin quilts with black
centers. I am fortunate enough to own one. Bought it in Paducah from a
vender in central Indiana.

Cindy

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 17:04:05 -0400 (EDT)
I’ve been reading this re-tread of the log cabin thread, and was
thinking….. (run for cover – it’s dangerous when I think!).

First, while I’m certain meanings have been attached to the center square of
log cabin quilts, I’m not comfortable that that is WHY the color was used in
the first place. I’m willing to bet that the first black-centered quilt was
happenstance – that someone was told “go down the street to the next street,
turn left, and go three houses on the left – they’re airing their black
centered log cabin quilt today”. But we have to keep in mind that the quilt
centers are probably (and I’m speaking of 19th century quilts) aesthetic
choices, mostly, with the meanings added later. For instance…

Sometime, if they still show it, watch “Myth America” on The Learning Channel
(maybe Discovery). They talk about long-held, historical fact we were taught
in school. Betsy Ross and her Flag. George Washington and his cherry tree.
Good old Plymouth Rock (which is located in many places!). It’s amazing
what damage was done to American history to make it more “pleasing”. And all
this has been researched by historians. For example, according to the show,
Victorians added the cute buckles to Pilgrim clothing because at that point
in time, the Victorians felt it added to the pastoral (?) feel of the legend.
George Washington wasn’t hailed as Father of the USA until sometime around
his centennial birthday, when we were in need of a hero. The show is really
interesting, because not only do you gain insight into the reality of
history, it also shows how things like fashion and the need for a hero can
bring an historical person to the forefront.

Another interesting historical-type show is “Connections” (all of the
series), starring James Burke. He will take a list of what we would see as
widely diverse, unconnected happenings/inventions/discoveries, and then lead
you from one to the other, showing how one lead to the next. Did you know
that analine dye was an ACCIDENT? The inventor/discoverer was trying to make
something else (I believe quinine, a medication for malaria), and
accidentally spilled some of his experiment on his lab coat, staining it
lavendar, the first analine color.

So maybe, just maybe, the log cabin quilt center is a myth started from a
need to popularize color usage.

Just a thought……….

Alan

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 17:55:07 -0400 (EDT)

On 29-JUL-1997 19:22:00.4 rsmeyer said to JOCELYNM

I didn’t know if this was a tale repeated for generations or if
anyone had actually seen one. Fantastic.
Rosemary,
There ARE black-centered Log Cabin quilts in existance. However, no one
(here) has yet to be able to connect one definitely with the Underground
Railway. It could just be the quilter didn’t like red.Or it could be
that a fanciful person saw such a quilt, and made up the story. But so far,
we haven’t been able to track a source that says ‘THIS quilt was made with
black centers to be used as a UR signal’.
But we keep trying!
Jocelyn

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 18:31:30 -0700
From: Lynn & Debbie CUPP

Dear Debbie,

Your block is #3804 in Brackman’s Encyclopedia of Pieced Quilt Patterns. pg
527,
called, Blazing Star – and listed by Brackman from Kansas City Star 1930.

Regards,
Julia

Thank you, Julia! I appreciate your quick response.

Sincerely,

Debbie Cupp

Dear Debbie,

Your block is #3804 in Brackman’s Encyclopedia of Pieced Quilt Patterns. pg
527,
called, Blazing Star – and listed by Brackman from Kansas City Star 1930.

Regards,
Julia

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 19:06:20 -0400 (EDT)
Is there a block design named the Undergound Railroad, or the Slave Chain?

Elisabeth

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 19:33:49 -0500 (CDT)
From:
To:
Hi Carla,
The “Arkansas Quilts”book is filled with beautiful photos of many, many
antique quilts and a little info about each quiltmaker. It was published by
American Quilter’s Society in 1988 and was written by the Arkansas Quilter’s
Guild. I have the AQS current book list and “Arkansas Quilts” is not there.
Possibly out print. If you PROMISE to return it, I would be happy to loan
you my copy. I had forgotten what a great book it is until I pulled it out
yesterday looking for documentation on black centers in log cabins. I saw
alot of wonderful quilts as I was scanning yesterday and it was good to
review my little library. Let me know if you are unable to find “Ark Quilts”
elsewhere. Oh yes, the number for AQS is 1-800-626-5420. Good luck!

Arlene in Texas

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 21:19:27 -0300
From: Luke Rafuse

Hello Everyone,

I’m new to QHL having only joined a week ago and I’m thoroughly
enjoying the posts on the history of the log cabins as it is my
favourite pattern. I’m wondering if anyone could give me information on
how I may learn more about the restoration of antique quilts (courses
books etc.) I cannot quilt with new materials as I have an allergy to
the chemicals used in new fabrics. I live in a rural area of Canada so
any Canadian information would be much appreciated as well as any U.S.
sources.

Thank you,

Carolyn

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 19:41:34 -0700
Can you stand one more post on this topic? In Stitched from the Soul: Slave
Quilts from the Ante-Bellum South, by Gladys-Marie Fry, Ph.D. (1990, Museum of
American Folk Art) on page 65:
“Quilts were used to send messges. On the underground railroad, those with the
color black in them were hung on the line to indicate a place of refuge (safe
house).” This bit of information is not specifically cited or footnoted.

Barbara Wunder Black
Ventura, California

Date: Wed, 30 Jul 1997 23:55:36 -0400 (EDT)

Thank you Brenda. It is just that accuracy that drew me to this list and
keeps me here. I trust that myth will be sorted from fact as much as
possible–even if it takes a few dozen posts!

Keep it up!

Janice Avila, in Sunny Salinas

Date: Thu, 31 Jul 1997 02:36:41 -0400 (EDT)
Can you stand one more post on this topic? In _Stitched from the Soul: Slave

Quilts from the Ante-Bellum South_, by Gladys-Marie Fry, Ph.D. (1990, Museum
of
American Folk Art) on page 65:
“Quilts were used to send messges. On the underground railroad, those with
the
color black in them were hung on the line to indicate a place of refuge
(safe
house).” This bit of information is not specifically cited or footnoted.

Barbara Wunder Black
Ventura, California

Barbara:
I hope I’m not alone in saying that no one should apologize for posting the
sort of information you contributed here. That’s why all of us are in this
group. We are all interested in this information. Could you possibly obtain
an address for the above info so that we might inquire as to their sources?
Thanks so much!!