July 31 – August 3, 1999
These restored messages come from the Quilt History List, an online forum where quilt historians, collectors, researchers, appraisers, and enthusiasts discussed antique quilts and related textiles. The archive dates from 1996 through approximately 2016 and is being restored gradually. Sign up in the form at the bottom of the page if you want to know when a new page is added. Original spelling, opinions, formatting, and inactive links may remain unchanged.
Primary topics of this QHL Digest:
- eBay Photo and Quilt Block Authenticity — Extended discussion of an eBay lot pairing quilt blocks with a purportedly 1869 photograph, with members analyzing clothing details, photographic technology, and possible centennial-celebration staging.
- Polyester Batting in 1970s–80s Quilts — Members debate the pros and cons of polyester batting from a historical-accuracy standpoint, sharing experiences with bearding, warmth, and the shift from poly to cotton batting. (see the article on quilt batting)
- Quilt Lectures and Speaker Fees — Xenia Cord and others discuss compensation practices for antique-quilt lecturers, including contracts, travel charges, and library freebies.
- Colorado Capitol Quilt Show — Reports on the Colorado Quilting Council’s biennial rotunda exhibition of 261 quilts, including how to order a photo set of all quilts shown.
- Des Moines Quilt Auction Results — A first-hand report on the Des Moines auction: over 250 quilts in very good condition, with pricing trends for mid-19th-century through Depression-era examples.
- Imported Quilts Documentation — A member’s relief at finding others researching imported quilts, with a reference to appraiser Carolyn Maruggi’s ongoing documentation of over 600 imported-quilt patterns.
- American Memory Quilt Collection Online — Marsha MacDowell announces the Quilts and Quiltmaking in America digital collection newly available through the Library of Congress American Memory program.
- Quilt Photography and Great-Grandmother’s Sewing School Photo — Sue Reich shares a parallel family photograph of eight young women from an 1880s–90s sewing school, adding context to the ongoing photo-authentication discussion.
Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 21:45:03 +0400 | From: Xenia Cord <xecord [at] netusa1 [dot] net
Hi, all – Have been on vacation and am picking up the threads of discussion from amidst 258 messages. No one has mentioned those of us who give lectures and other programs on antique quilts and related textiles, and the problems often encountered there as far as fees are concerned. This is another place where “get the fee up front” is really important.
When people call me about doing a program, I am not shy about stating my fees, including travel, housing (as needed) and the cost of extra baggage if I fly and bring the usual 40 or so antique quilts and other artifacts that will be a part of my presentation. I usually leave the caller an “out” by suggesting that he’she probably needs to discuss the information with the originating committee, and that I will wait to hear from them. It’s amazing how that often simplifies my schedule <G>! I love doing programs, but I think I have invested a great deal of time over the past 20 years studying and assessing and accumulating information on the field of American antique quilts, and that investment deserves recognition in the form of compensation when I share. One of my university faculty friends, an expert in a fairly esoteric area, once drove 3 hours each way to deliver a dinner lecture, and was paid with – DINNER!
Her fault for not getting the fee clarified before hand, but I learned a valuable lesson there at her expense. The knowledge that we have accumulated, whether in the practical aspects of invisible repair/restoration, expert quilting, and/or conservation, and in research and education – should be recognized for the importance it has Shouldn’t we value it ourselves enough to charge accordingly for our time and talents?
OK – I’m done for now –
Xenia
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 10:00:11 EDT | From: AlineMcK [at] aol [dot] com
Several people mentioned using polyester batting because it’s so extremely 1976ish, which is true. But I’d worry about the polyester scouring the fabric from the inside and eventually damaging the quilt (I saw a very dramatic example of this at one of Lisa & Laura’s excellent “quilt colleges”). Since the fabric is, if I recall correctly, a poly blend, would this help protect the quilt from the batting? Or would adding a protective underlayer of muslim work? Or is there a cotton batting that can duplicate the look of polyester? (And I can’t believe I just wrote that sentence.)
Aline
Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 09:21:02 -0500 | From: Laura Hobby Syler <texas_quilt.co [at] mail [dot] airmail [dot] net>
Hi Clare and all,
I will agree with fellow appraiser Bev on this one…and if you read Aileen’s post you also know another reason why. When the polyester batting became widely available I sold truck loads of it in my quilt shop…had one or two batts of cotton for “those stuck in the past” <G>. It was so wonderful to quilt, so light, so 20th century…..but the last 20 years have proven that not every new-fangled contraption is good. Bearding is the first sign of trouble. And it can start even before you get the top finished (especially if you are quilting in a hoop). But the long term effects of the poly batting on the cotton, poly/cotton fabrics are just beginning to be seen. I’ve at least 3 quilts that were quilted in the early ’80’s…circa 1900-1920 tops, using polyester batting, Fairfield Traditional to be exact (to immulate the cotton loft). We have used them on a fairly regular basis and thay are deteorating from the inside out. Cotton battings were used continually throughout the 70’s to mid ’90’s…..so using a cotton batting is not going to deminish the integrity of the quilt…..
But if you value your hands….DONT use a sheet on the back <G> Talk about a chore to quilt!!
Good luck and thanks for sharing your find with the group.
Laura
In steamy N. Texas..At 10:13 AM 7/31/99 -0700, Beverly Dunivent wrote:
>Hi Clare: I hate to disagree with my friend and fellow AQS quilt appraiser Cindy Brick BUT I would think twice about using the polyester batting in the Bicentennial quilt. First let me say I think it is great you are finishing it. What a wonderful tribute to the maker of the top as well as the era in which it was made. As for the polyester, I would hesitate using it because of the way it loves to “beard” through on solid color fabrics, especially reds and blues making quilts look like they need a shave. Even though the fabrics are poly blends I would at least consider cotton batting or I would use the dark colored poly batting available from Fairfield (I think). Bev. Dunivent, from the cool mountains in Southern California
Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 08:17:03 -0700 | From: “Julia D. Zgliniec” <rzglini1 [at] san [dot] rr [dot] com>
Dear KareQuilt and QHL,
DON”T toss them! My friend and colleague Carolyn Maruggi has been documenting the imported quilts since they first hit the market. I will ask her if she wants them and let you know. To date she has documented over 300 different ones. This is a problem for appraisers too. For example, if someone receives one as a gift and does not know anything about quilts, or purchases one at a thrift store, and brings them an appraiser, we have to be able to recognize them for what they are and value them accordingly.
Thank you for your post,
Julia Zgliniec – Appraiser, certified by AQS
KareQuilt [at] aol [dot] com wrote:
> I have at least one “mover’s equivalent book size box” full of mail order catalogues that I have collected that contain photos of imported quilts that have saturated the market in the last 8-10 years. I think I have two full boxes, but I have just moved and still haven’t unpacked everything. Is anyone doing research in this field? Has anyone ever considered trying to catalogue these quilts? If no one is interested, I am going to toss them. I have enough stuff to lug around without these!!
> KareQuilt
> Northern Virginia
Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 11:46:36 -0500 | From: LAHughes <kehughes [at] home [dot] com>
Hello Aline et all,
I’m looking for a copy of the 1995 Mimi Dietrich book: Quilts from the Smithsonian. If anyone comes across a copy, I’d be happy to take it off your hands…*grin*
Lori Hughes
Troy, MI
Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 12:04:54 PDT | From: “Anne Copeland” <anneappraiser [at] hotmail [dot] com>
The quilts done with poly batting are not warm either, not at all. A friend made me one, and although it is very dear to have the quilt, it is not good for keeping myself warm when it is cold, and is hot when it is hot! Cheers, Anne Copeland P.S. I originally thought it would probably be better to use poly batting to keep with the times, but not now!
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 15:15:10 -0600 | From: “Cindy Brick” <Brickworks [at] fnmail [dot] com>
There…now you have several opinions on poly batts! Actually, I wasn’t advocating polys for ease of use or anything like that — merely historical authenticity. Same for sheets, although they are a huge pain in the patootie to quilt through. (But muslin’s historically ok, too.)
And both Laura and Bev have an excellent point about the bearding problem…I have seen this in a quilt I made around 1984 (poor baby). I have also seen polys that have lasted quite well through the decades, as well.
You need to do what you decide is best! Both my esteemed colleagues have had a lot of experience in this field, and I have no problem with them disagreeing with me. There’s room for all…isn’t that what makes this field so wonderful!?!
Off to New York and QHL…Cindy
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 17:30:58 -0400 | From: “Gloria Infinger” <gloria [at] nations [dot] net>
>Caroline wrote: “…. Quilt Instructor.”
Would like to hear more about what she teaches. Are there more instructors across the USA connected with college? Silks can be found on eBay from time to time to try to win. Some of the flowers are beautiful.
Gloria Infinger gloria [at] nations [dot] net
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 15:29:56 -0600 | From: “Cindy Brick” <Brickworks [at] fnmail [dot] com>
[Don’t use a sheet for hand quilting. Back then there were very few books on quilting. Many of us were learning by hard experience and that is one thing we all learned was no sheets for hand quilting. ] Really??? Maybe it’s the Michigan connection, Caroline — but sheets were de rigeur for backs…at least, that was what I remember being told then. Of course, the people I knew doing quilting were generally into the thrift thing. I was a regular reader of QNM, and got my paws on every QUILT I could, but had little contact at that point with established guilds or professional quilters. I was doing quilting for people, but would use whatever they specified for the back. Usually, it was some kind of print fabric, which I had to seam together to make the back wide enough.
Cindy
Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 21:53:15 -0400 | From: “Judy Kelius (judysue)” <judy [at] chesco [dot] com>
Well, I bought the photo and quilt piece and will let you know. The photo is obviously posed, but they did that a lot in the 19th century too and may have even dressed up in colonial clothing. I agree with you that the dresses are not 1860’s. If the photo is not old, I will return it and ask for my money back. The fabrics in the blocks are obviously right for the period.
At 09:41 PM 8/1/99 -0400, John Cawley wrote:
The women in the picture which supposedly shows them working on an 1869 quilt look to me like people dressed up for some Colonial Revival event. Those clothes don’t look like 1869. What do others think? Cinda on the Eastern Shore
—–Original Message—– From: Lorraine Olsson <sven [at] pnc [dot] com [dot] au> To: qhl [at] cuenet [dot] com <qhl [at] cuenet [dot] com> Date: Sunday, August 01, 1999 9:18 PM Subject: QHL: Heads up history buffs!!!!!!
>History Buffs!! > >Take a look at this item on eBay > >http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=137121542 > >Lorraine in Oz > >
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 21:54:12 EDT | From: Tubeywooby [at] aol [dot] com
In a message dated 7/29/99 8:57:12 PM, QHL-Digest-request [at] cuenet [dot] com writes: << Melissa had written that her mom paid 100 dollars per spool to have a quilt quilted. >>
Yes I did, and I wondered myself then how many yards on a spool. Maybe to charge by the 100 yards of thread? But of course the value would be placed then on the size of stitching and intricacy of pattern. But maybe it gives a rough estimate on the amount of quilting done- scant verses heavy, and a way a quilter could estimate how much time was put into a quilt? So glad to have my QHLs waiting to welcome me as I come back from a weekend in San Antonio, where I started my first Baltimore album quilt!
Melissa
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 22:05:24 EDT | From: Tubeywooby [at] aol [dot] com
< I am “Class of 1976” from high school >>
Me too!
My mama was learning to quilt from our next door neighbor in the late 60s and early 70s (I got my stitches in) and had the hardest time finding cottons, and savored all they could find. They used muslin to back their quilts. Poly batts. I guess the thinking was you looked at the front and why waste $ on the back?
Melissa
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 12:54:29 -0500 | From: “Steve and Jean Loken” <sandjloken [at] worldnet [dot] att [dot] net
We’ve just finishing hanging over 50 quilts discovered during the QDDs we had in the late 80s and early 90s and some more recently here in Minnesota. The show will be open Aug. 4-31, 1999 at the Dakota County Historical Society museum in South St. Paul, MN. Hours are Tues, Wed, Friday 9-5; Thursday, 9-8 and Sat. 10-3. There are lectures on opening night by Darlene Zimmerman on the collection itself; Aug 7 at 1:00 by Terry Thompson on “1876-1900, The Centennial Years” and Aug. 21 at 1:00 by Pat Cox, “On The Road to Bankruptcy” about collecting quilts. The museum is located at 130 3rd Avenue N. in South St. Paul. The show includes some quilts from the collection of the Hennepin History Museum, including a wonderful early 1800s never-washed chintz broderie perse which is 108″ square. It also includes some of Pat Cox’s quilts which were most recently shown in Dallas. A special feature is a small local group of Sunbonnet Sue quilts, which design was created in Minnesota by illustrator Bertha Corbett.
A catalog of the collection has been published which includes photos of most of the quilts and will be available for $10.00, and by mail from the Project. E-mail me privately with any requests.
Jean Loken in MN, cool at last.
Date: Sun, 1 Aug 1999 22:57:04 -0400 | From: “Judy Grow” <Judygrow [at] blast [dot] net>
Take a look at this item on eBay
This from the seller of the piece in question:
>The photograph is of the period and shows 4 women in period calico dresses
and bonnets working >on this piece. The photo is 10�H X 7�W which is large for a photograph from this period. Very few >period photographs exist showing quilt making and to have one that comes with the actual quilt
>section shown in the photograph is virtually unique. If you examine the
photograph carefully you�ll see >the women have their little calico sewing bags over their arms. The photograph is in outstanding >condition. Did anyone else who went to E-bay to look at this piece get a funny feeling? I really think the blocks are what the seller says they are, but I think the photograph is more like a Wallace Nutting Colonial Revival [photograph from the turn of the century. Could we have another opinion, please?
Judy in Ringoes, NJ judygrow [at] blast [dot] net
Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 21:11:28 PDT | From: “Anne Copeland” <anneappraiser [at] hotmail [dot] com
I totally agree with you, Judy. The photo is very suspicious, both for the lively posed look of the ladies and something even about their costumes. People from real photos of that time always looked so straight-laced, and the women were typically shy and had a very different look on their faces. It would not be unusual for some dealer or person to unknowingly put the two together however, since the blocks appear the same. I would say you are right on. Caveat emptor. Anne
Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 00:28:20 -0400 | From: “Judy Grow” <Judygrow [at] blast [dot] net>
There is a very nice article in the current issue of the Magazine Antiques on Quaker Quilts. It is by Patricia Keller. Lots of good illustrations, most I’ve not seen before.
Judy in Ringoes, NJ judygrow [at] blast [dot] net
Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 00:34:22 -0400 | From: “Judy Grow” <Judygrow [at] blast [dot] net>
I wouldn’t be surprised if the blocks are the same ones in the photo. Perhaps they came down in the family of one of the women in the photo, with the photo. But with nothing written on the back of the photo to identify the sitters, and no accompanying note, in 2 more generations great-great aunt Clara became a mystery person instead of the celebrity in a sentimental posed studio “still.”
Judy in Ringoes, NJ judygrow [at] blast [dot] net
—– Original Message —–
From: Anne Copeland <anneappraiser [at] hotmail [dot] com> To: <Judygrow [at] blast [dot] net>; <QHL [at] cuenet [dot] com> Cc: <sven [at] pnc [dot] com [dot] au>
Sent: Monday, August 02, 1999 12:11 AM
Subject: Re: QHL: sold on e-bay
> I totally agree with you, Judy. The photo is very suspicious, both for
the
> lively posed look of the ladies and something even about their costumes. People from real photos of that time always looked so straight-laced, and the women were typically shy and had a very different look on their faces. It would not be unusual for some dealer or person to unknowingly put the
two
> together however, since the blocks appear the same. I would say you are right on. Caveat emptor. Anne
> _______________________________________________________________ Get Free Email and Do More On The Web. Visit http://www.msn.com
Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 21:49:26 -0700 | From: Audrey Waite <awquiltr [at] sedona [dot] net>
Hi all:
If you have been following the thread about storing your books and magazines, you won’t be surprised to hear that on top of a stack of magazines in my living room was a Quilter’s Newsletter magazine from May 1993 which was calling to me.
I hadn’t looked very far before I discovered an article on p. 9 “More Than 200 Quilt Copies Now Being Imported” which would be of interest to KareQuilt and others as well. Seems Carolyn Maruggi of Pittsford, NY had catalogued 205 quilts in 119 different patterns that are being copied and mass-produced overseas for import to the US. Probably many more in the last 6 years. She had already been researching the subject for 2 years. The article goes on to say that she is planning to document her findings in a book so that the information will be available to collectors in the future.
Hopefully she will have some more current news about this problem for appraisers and also about her progress on the reported book. So you see my filing system works in mysterious ways!
Audrey Waite in sunny Sedona, AZ
Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 08:15:59 -0400 | From: “Store E-Mail Acct.” <qps [at] quiltingposs [dot] com>
When I started quilting in 1976 or 1977, everything was polyester, the fabric, the thread, the batting, you name it. We didn’t have to iron! The quilts I made will never die, they will just pill & beard to death! VBG And the slide right off the bed continuously. Mine are hot, they are like a layer of plastic over you, your body heat heats the space up and because its poly, it has no place to go so you over heat. I still sell the poly batts in my shop, not as much as the cotton but I still have a few die hards who insist on using poly. Thats their choice, its their quilt. When I am contacted to do a lecture, I send a contract. It clearly states my fee and travel charges. Its simple, just something I made up on the computer. I send two copies, they keep one and sign and send the other back to me. I get more calls from the county library system to do free programs, now I am limiting the freebies I do, it gets to the point where they are taking advantage of you.
Debbie in NJ
Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 08:56:28 EDT | From: Baglady111 [at] aol [dot] com
While in IOWA for the IOWA STATE QUILT GUILD’S SHOW, I heard rave reviews about CHRISTINE BROWN. She is from Colo and has some hefty credentials behind her…IOWA was REALLY impressed..I don’t know very much about judging, but since I get around and I hear high praise on the person..I like to share..so if you are looking for a judge at your next show..check out CHRISTINE BROWN of LITTLETON, COLO and I’ll bet our SADIE ROSE can get you her address…
Jane of THE FEEDSACK CLUB
http://members.aol.com/baglady111/
Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 08:46:31 EDT | From: DDBSTUFF [at] aol [dot] com
In a message dated 8/1/99 9:57:58 PM Eastern Daylight Time, QHL-Digest-request [at] cuenet [dot] com writes:
Xenia and all,
I too used to give talks and workshops on Antique Amish Quilts and found that everyone and every organization didn’t want to or couldn’t afford to pay much so, I simply raised my fee to a FAIR hourly wage which took into account the time it took in preparation, packing, travel, setting up, time away from home etc. and now I don’t have to do all that work and preparation and travel at all. I never really liked doing it anyway.
Darwin
Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 08:47:09 EDT | From: Baglady111 [at] aol [dot] com
Recently I was a guest lecturer at the IOWA STATE
GUILD’s QUILT SHOW..MIMI
DIETRICH was on the schedule also but due to poor health of her mother, she had to cancel..My loss because she and I have been hosted by the same persons but have never met… I had a note from SADIE ROSE, one of my hostesses while there and she told me yesterday that MIMI’s mother has passed away..Any of you who have met MIMI or would like to send her a message at this time, please contact SADIE ROSE for her address..
JANE of THE FEEDSACK CLUB
http://members.aol.com/baglady111/
Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 08:55:42 EDT | From: Chyral [at] aol [dot] com
> The photo is very suspicious, both for the lively posed look of the ladies and something even about their costumes. People from real photos of that time always looked so straight-laced, and the women were typically shy and had a very different look on their faces.
The clothing is “right” for about 1880-1885 (slim, draped skirt & cuirasse bodice on woman at front left, those peculiar sleeves on woman at front right). The caps, those silly “Puritan” collars (!!!!!!) and what appears to be white powdered hair are probably someone’s Romantic imaginings of things Colonial and ye good olde days, and have nothing to do with mid to late nineteenth century garb.
From the eBay listing in question:
“The photograph is of the period and shows 4 women in period calico dresses and bonnets working on this piece. The photo is 10”H X 7”W which is large for a photograph from this period. Very few period photographs exist showing quilt making and to have one that comes with the actual quilt section shown in the photograph is virtually unique. If you examine the photograph carefully you’ll see the women have their little calico sewing bags over their arms. The photograph is in outstanding condition. This is truly an amazing find. “
Amazing indeed. 😉
Photographic images of the purported date are almost always ferrotypes, or of Carte de Visite size; cabinet cards, such as the image in question, did not become common until the early 1870s. For my part, I am curious as to where the exact “dating” of these items of 1869 derives from….. are the blocks signed, or is there some sort of documentation?
Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 09:02:31 +0000 | From: Bobbie Aug <qwltpro [at] uswest [dot] net>
Dear Deb,
So glad you liked The Colorado Quilting Council’s Capitol Quilt show. There were 261 quilts hung and this happens every other year in the “odd” years. In the even years, we hold a symposium in Estes Park, Colorado with about 18 out of state nationally known teachers and our chief education event. Wish we could hang the quilts every year, but it costs us about $8,000 to hire professionals to bring in a cherry picker and hang those quilts from the marble pillars in the rotunda and other areas and also is expensive to print those programs – at least 10,000 of them. All for free to the public. Also, we do not make any profit from the pictures that we offer. They are priced at cost only. We have close to 1400 members and meet every month in a different city in our state. It is so nice to know that we have shared quilts with folks in other places too.
Bobbie A. Aug
Colorado Springs
Debra Reynen wrote:
> I just got back from 10 days of travel through Iowa, Nebraska and Colorado.
I was able to see a number of quilt exhibits along the
> way. I read about the Capitol Quilt Show in Denver CO on this list and so we stopped there also. It was WONDERFUL! Some of the quilts actually brought tears to my eyes. It is still going on and according to the program I have it will continue through August 5th, 1999.
If
> you can believe it, photos were allowed. I took pictures of a few of the quilts that really spoke to me – hopefully they turn out. The program gives the maker’s name and a couple of sentences about the quilt. For those of you that can’t get there, you can actually order a set of pictures of all of the quilts (over 200). The following information was in the back of the program. (I am not affiliated with this organization in any way.) Cost: $125 for an entire set of all quilts in the showDeadline for orders is August 20, 1999. Photos will be mailed by September 20, 1999. Make checks payable to Colorado Quilting Council and mail to:Dawn Mills2596 South Rifle StreetAurora CO 80013-1570 By the way although I did not buy any quilts or fabric while on this trip, I did buy 15 different quilt history books that I found in various stores, museums, etc. that I did not already have. Needless to say my suitcase and carry-on bags were REALLY heavy! Deb Reynen – IL
Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 13:33:30 -0600 | From: Jocelyn <jocelynm [at] sw1 [dot] socwel [dot] ukans [dot] edu>
> Maybe I was thinking flower arrangements–wrong! I saw the in-progress paintings a month later–we’re talking about both a man and two woman models (not in the same painting– different paintings and quilts-) sprawled, sitting, squatting–buck-naked wide open (use your imagination) on MY BELOVED QUILTS!
Pepper,
Too bad you didn’t ask to borrow some of HER work to support yours….as in draping your quilts over her frames…..
Jocelyn
Jocelynm [at] delphi [dot] com
Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 15:14:55 EDT | From: SLAMAFOOS [at] aol [dot] com
Please change my e-mail address from slamafoos [at] aol [dot] com to daveangelaslama [at] juno [dot] com
Thanks.
angela slama
Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 12:22:51 +0000 | From: Bobbie Aug <qwltpro [at] uswest [dot] net
Carolyn is a quilt appraiser certified by AQS. The last I heard, she had over 600 patterns documented. She gave a wonderful lecture a couple of years ago at the AQS show in Paducah, KY on this very topic. Don’t know about a book, tho. However, I will see her in a few days and will ask.
Bobbie A. Aug
Colorado Springs
Audrey Waite wrote:
> Hi all:
> If you have been following the thread about storing your books and magazines, you won’t be surprised to hear that on top of a stack of magazines in my living room was a Quilter’s Newsletter magazine from May 1993 which was calling to me.
> I hadn’t looked very far before I discovered an article on p. 9 “More Than 200 Quilt Copies Now Being Imported” which would be of interest to KareQuilt and others as well. Seems Carolyn Maruggi of Pittsford, NY had catalogued 205 quilts in 119 different patterns that are being copied and mass-produced overseas for import to the US. Probably many more in the last 6 years. She had already been researching the subject for 2 years. The article goes on to say that she is planning to document her findings in a book so that the information will be available to collectors in the future.
> Hopefully she will have some more current news about this problem for appraisers and also about her progress on the reported book.
> So you see my filing system works in mysterious ways!
> Audrey Waite in sunny Sedona, AZ
Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 17:03:00 -0600 | From: Sharon Harleman Tandy <harleman [at] micron [dot] net>
Hi all,
I may be not seeing right, but on the 3rd woman from the left–isn’t she wearing ‘cat’s eye’ glasses, like I wore in the late ’50s? Sharon.
Date: Mon, 2 Aug 99 21:33:30 -0500 | From: Woodford <woodford [at] ix [dot] netcom [dot] com>
Re the Des Moines Quilt auction:
This was a well-displayed collection of over 250 very nice quilts, almost all in very good condition. There were some mid 19th century quilts, more late 19th century, and plenty of early 20th century with various stages of expertise in the execution. There was a ca 1800 Palimpore, but no really fabulous old ones. The owner seemed to have been especially interested in finding unusual patchwork patterns. The prices were mostly in the $200-$600 range, but a few went up to $2000-3000. I bought 21 quilts, and, believe me, I do not expect to make a 400% profit on them. It is a relief that these were in such good condition that I don’t have to wash or destain a single one.
Respectfully,
Barbara Woodford
Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 21:33:37 -0500 | From: Valerie Davis <vpse [at] globaldialog [dot] com>
OK, I’ll go out on a limb about that photo that was sold recently with the 1869 quilt pieces. This is my take on the photo. First the photograph is contrived but not the way you would think. To my experience the photo is old probably from the 1880’s but the ladies pictured did contrive to look “Colonial” by donning white caps and collars of Colonial women. I say 1880’s because the look of the bustles they are wearing are typically late 19th century. Also the dark colors dresses, tight fitting sleeves all point to the late 1880’s. I enjoy searching for old photographs of images of women quilting and/or hand stitching and the ones I have seen all look very “posed’ as these women do. Most of these types of photographs we taken to document these women engaged in needlework of one sort or another either to advertise their expertise in the craft or possibly to document their local needle craft group. Why these women chose to be photographed with quilt pieces much older, or why they chose to look “Colonial” I can’t fathom. Anyone else have any ideas?
By the way I’m a volunteer curator at a local historical museum, and we have almost identical quilt pieces at the museum, only ours are not sewed together. The fabrics used look very similar to the ones on eBay, but some of ours are signed in India ink, and are from Milwaukee, WI. For the life of me I can’t remember if any are dated, but I sure will check next time I’m at the
Museum.
Valerie
Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 22:52:30 -0400 | From: “Judy Kelius (judysue)” <judy [at] chesco [dot] com>
At 09:33 PM 8/2/99 -0500, Valerie Davis wrote:
OK, I’ll go out on a limb about that photo that was sold recently with the 1869 quilt pieces. This is my take on the photo. First the photograph is contrived but not the way you would think. To my experience the photo is old probably from the 1880’s but the ladies pictured did contrive to look “Colonial” by donning white caps and collars of Colonial women. I say 1880’s because the look of the bustles they are wearing are typically late 19th century. Also the dark colors dresses, tight fitting sleeves all point to the late 1880’s. I enjoy searching for old photographs of images of women quilting and/or hand stitching and the ones I have seen all look very “posed’ as these women do. Most of these types of photographs we taken to document these women engaged in needlework of one sort or another either to advertise their expertise in the craft or possibly to document their local needle craft group. Why these women chose to be photographed with quilt pieces much older, or why they chose to look “Colonial” I can’t fathom. Anyone else have any ideas? I’m the “lucky buyer” or the “there’s one born every second,” depending on your point of view! When I asked the seller why he dated it 1869, he wrote that this is written on the back of the photo. I think it will be easy to have a vintage photo expert determine when the photo was taken – if it’s an “early” (20’s or earlier) colonial revival photo, I’ll still be happy with my purchase. I won’t be surprised if it was taken during the 20’s when the tremendous explosion in quiltmaking took place. Then again, even women in 1869 could have dressed in colonial costume for photos like this. I have no doubt the blocks are from the 1860’s.
I love mysteries! Will let you all know the outcome of this.
Date: Tue, 03 Aug 1999 10:35:58 +0400 | From: Xenia Cord <xecord [at] netusa1 [dot] net
I was unable to open the image icons displayed with the description of the old quilt with accompanying photo – but I will still hazard a guess about the apparently staged image. Is it possible that this is a photo from the American Centennial?
I ask because I have in my vintage garment collection a wonderfully made “colonial” dress in cream silk, with panniers, an underskirt, tight sleeves, lined bodice etc., – but the dress is machine seamed with hand finishing, and the silk has small oriental designs worked into it. All of this suggests to me a dress made to represent an earlier time, but made using “current” technology and materials (i.e. 1876-80.)
Just a thought –
Xenia
Date: Mon, 2 Aug 1999 23:50:45 EDT | From: KareQuilt [at] aol [dot] com
Wow! Thanks for your responses. I was so pleased to discover there are at least three quilters doing research on the imported quilts. Now I don’t feel so “silly” for having saved all those catalogues. [I kid you not; my quilt, genealogy and folk art books and files take up one whole room, not including fabric, quilts, or sewing machine. I still have to find room for those somewhere else and still have a guest room for when the kids come visit!] I obviously had begun to save the catalogues because I thought I might do a research project myself, but one can spread one’s self only so thin. Having heard from individuals and institutions, my preference would be that they would eventually wind up in a research center where many researchers could access them. I’ll keep you posted. One question that has been on my mind since they first began appearing was, “I wonder whether being exposed to American quilt patterns in this manner will cause the women/men who make the “factory made” quilts want to make similar quilts for their own personal use?” Where have most of these quilts been made? In countries that already have a tradition of quilting? China? Elsewhere? Has anyone actually traced them down to the actual city and factory in said country? Is there any possible way of finding out if the workers are going home and making similar quilts for their own families?
Karen Alexander
Research Focus:
The Quilts of Page, Shenandoah, and Rockingham Counties of the Shenandoah Valley of Virginia
Documenting the Family Quilt
Press Secretary, Quilters Hall of Fame
Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 23:17:23 -0500 | From: Russell-Hill <russhill [at] ctesc [dot] net>
I had a look at the women in the photo also and think it it be 1870’s maybe 76 as a centenial celebration. the mob caps seem to give the appearence of that idea. I don’t get the collar but then I know of reenactors today who still don’t have their clothing period correct. I am saying 70’s for this picture.
Since they are sitting down the size of the bustle is hidden and that could help in the dating. Love the album blocks and the fact that they could be the same as in the photo makes them even more special.
Debbie
Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 23:02:37 PDT | From: “Anne Copeland” <anneappraiser [at] hotmail [dot] com>
Boy, you brought up some good issues. I have thought for some time now that someday, those prisoners who do get out and go home will have learned a skill set that could bring them money in the future, and surely was less hard on them than say, breaking rocks! Not to joke about it, it is a skill learned, and it is possible that the skill will someday grow into a business somehow. It happened with many of the American Indians, who made their crafts early on strictly for the traders. They absolutely had no context or tradition for those crafts at all. Yet they all ultimately became famous when their arts became collectible and quite desirable on the international market as well. This is not to say that quilts made in China will ever become collectible or valuable, but it could lead to the development of something better eventually. Who is to say?
As for other countries involved in the quiltmaking, Haiti has quite a thriving business going making quilts for, I believe I remember this right, The Gazebo of New York, and they put out a fine catalog. Many of their quilts sold are based on 1930s and 1940s kit quilt designs, but many are innovative and very nice. The prices on these quilts are very high too, not the $29 Sears or Penneys varieties. We are talking $800 for a quilt and more and that is a pretty good rate as we are talking about dollar values for work done, though in this case, who is getting the dollars? The quiltmakers? I think probably not. But this is at least one other country I know about currently involved in quiltmaking.
The whole thing is wierd because if you are going to import, why not go to say, Mexico to get the labor, where you have to go very little distance to get the materials, quilts, etc. back and forth? And from what I have personally seen in the interior there, I would think labor would be pretty cheap and readily available. There must be something in this long distance market I am not quite figuring out! Anne
Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 05:09:12 -0400 | From: Marsha MacDowell <macdowel [at] pilot [dot] msu [dot] edu
QHL members should check this wonderful new offering: Quilts and Quiltmaking in America now available on American Memory The National Digital Library Program and the American Folklife Center of the Library of Congress are pleased to announce the release of the online presentation Quilts and Quiltmaking in America. There are many ways to study quiltmaking, but one of the most rewarding is to look at the kinds of quilts that were made in a particular time and place. To understand the local picture, however, a researcher needs to know how the local traditions compare with national trends or with local traditions elsewhere. Quilts and Quiltmaking in America presents 181 segments from recorded interviews with quiltmakers and 410 graphic images (prints, positive transparencies, and negatives) from two collections in the American Folklife Center: the Blue Ridge Parkway Folklife Project and the Lands=92 End All-American Quilt Contest Collection. The images of the quilts convey the range of contemporary quiltmaking styles in the United States, while the recorded interview segments provide a more in-depth portrait of quiltmaking within the context of the quiltmakers=92 lives and region.
The quilt-related information in the Blue Ridge Parkway Folklife Project is significant because it represents in-depth interviews with a number of quiltmakers within a limited geographic area during the late-twentieth-century quiltmaking revival. Photographs and brief interview segments were chosen from the collection by the project=92s consultant, Laurel Horton, to provide viewers with a guide to the story of quiltmaking in the Blue Ridge. She selected six individuals who represent a cross-section of the quiltmakers in the region at the time of the project (1978) and selected photographs and narratives of both historic and newly made quilts. Because the interview subjects present a range of backgrounds, motivations, and aesthetic sensibilities, their interviews reveal the difficulty of defining a single =93Appalachian=94 quiltmaking tradition. The quilts selected represent a range of functional types, including utility bedquilts, elaborate special quilts, and those made to sell at craft shops and flea markets. As a result, the interviews and visual images demonstrate both continuing local traditions and the influence of the national quilt revival. In the years since it was created, the Blue Ridge collection has become an important source of historical information. In order to enhance its accessibility to researchers who may be hearing-impaired, unfamiliar with the dialect of the subject or interviewer, use English as a second language, or need clarification of quilt-related vocabulary or local place names, all audio material in this online collection has been transcribed by Ms. Horton.
The Lands=92 End collection provides a different but complementary window into late-twentieth-century quiltmaking. This online presentation documents the 181 state and national winners of contests sponsored by the company in 1992, 1994, and 1996, and reflects a sampling of excellent design and technical skill characteristic of prizewinning quilts during this period. This collection is important because it represents a large number of quilt images from all across the country and because it includes statements provided by the makers in surveys about their quilts. The Lands=92 End contest winners represent a wide range of quiltmaking activity, from highly traditional to innovative. This addition to the American Memory Historical Collections can be accessed at the following url:
<<http://memory.loc.gov/ammem/qlthtml/qlthome.html> The mission of the Library of Congress is to make its resources available and useful to Congress and the American people and to sustain and preserve a universal collection of knowledge and creativity for future generations. The goal of the Library’s National Digital Library Program is to offer broad public access to a wide range of historical and cultural documents as a contribution to education and lifelong learning.
Please direct any questions to NDLPCOLL [at] loc [dot] gov Marsha MacDowell
Michigan State University Museum macdowel [at] pilot [dot] msu [dot] edu
http://www.museum.msu.edu
Date: Tue, 03 Aug 1999 10:47:11 -0600 | From: Jocelyn <jocelynm [at] sw1 [dot] socwel [dot] ukans [dot] edu
> They used muslin to back their quilts. Poly batts. I guess the thinking was you looked at the front and why waste $ on the back?
I think this was probably a motive back in the Depression era, when colored fabric was scarce enough you wouldn’t want to ‘waste’ it…but by 1976, I suspect that the motive was to replicate older quilts, rather than economy alone. Although I have to admit that it’s some of each, in my case. <G> I really don’t ‘get’ spending $12-15 a yard on backing fabrics nobody sees. I guess it’s like the underwear vs. lingerie argument! <G>
Jocelyn
Jocelynm [at] delphi [dot] com
Date: Tue, 03 Aug 1999 11:01:35 -0600 | From: Jocelyn <jocelynm [at] sw1 [dot] socwel [dot] ukans [dot] edu>
> he clothing is “right” for about 1880-1885 (slim, draped skirt & cuirasse bodice on woman at front left, those peculiar sleeves on woman at front right). The caps, those silly “Puritan” collars (!!!!!!)
> Amazing indeed. 😉
Photographic images of the purported date are almost
> always ferrotypes, or of Carte de Visite size; cabinet cards, such as the image in question, did not become common until the early 1870s.
> For my part, I am curious as to where the exact “dating” of these items of 1869 derives from….. are the blocks signed, or is there some sort of documentation?
Soooo…we have a photo that’s been ‘adjusted’ in some way. The women are obviously not in mid-to-late 19th century everyday clothing. But…that doesn’t mean they’re not mid-to-late 19th century women. It could be that they were celebrating a centennial, and were costumed according to their abilities. (I’ll never forget the time that I was costuming a Renaissance group, and one woman volunteered, ‘My daughter already has a costume- she was in the centennial last year!’ ) They may just have been really lousy costumers– figuring that if they put Puritan collars and mobcaps on over their regular dresses, that that would be all the effort required. For that matter, they may have figured it would be a waste of time and money to make up a real Puritan dress to wear just for the celebration. So…they may have started the quilt in 1869, and then, a few years later after the larger photographs became available, had the portrait made then. Maybe they happened to know a photographer who was really on the cutting edge of his art, or maybe, the blocks were made in 1869, and 10 or so years later, someone stumbled across them again and said, ‘Wouldn’t it be a hoot to get our picture made, in our old centennial costumes?’ I’d think that someone who was deliberately trying to create a hoax would have been smart enough to have created a picture without any anachronistic elements in it…but then, maybe I’m just an optimist. <G>
Jocelyn
Jocelynm [at] delphi [dot] com
Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 13:08:14 EDT | From: Chyral [at] aol [dot] com
I in no way meant to convey the impression that I believe the photograph is a “hoax” of some sort…. only that, based on my fair-to-middling hands-on knowledge of both 19th century dress and photographs, the dating of the photograph to 1869 was perhaps 10 years or so on the early side. In the parlance of the antiques trade, I do think it’s “good”. Mea culpa, for my lack of clarity.
Allow me a bit of anecdotal meandering, if you will….. per Judy’s information, the date of 1869 was derived by the seller solely from a notation on the reverse of the photograph…. My husband and I are “the keepers of the family history” and thus possess a large number of family photographs, dating from the mid 1860s or so; many of these photographs bear penciled notations as to the date or subject, and most of those notations are worthless…. the “identifications” were “best guesses” made in the 1970s by a relative who never knew any of the subjects, and most of the “dates” are simply a number most likely assigned by the photographer to identify his filing of the negative, should reprints be desired….. (What I’ve been trying to figure out is what the other three women in the picture are doing…. the ones who don’t have the quilt blocks. The one standing at the rear left seems to be knitting, but what are the other two ladies up to??? Perhaps the image should be titled “Busy Hands are Happy Hands”…… )
In a message dated 8/3/99 11:56:33 AM Eastern Daylight Time, jocelynm [at] sw1 [dot] socwel [dot] ukans [dot] edu writes:
> > he clothing is “right” for about 1880-1885 (slim, draped skirt & cuirasse bodice on woman at front left, those peculiar sleeves on woman at front right). The caps, those silly “Puritan” collars (!!!!!!)
> > Amazing indeed. 😉
Photographic images of the purported date are almost
> > always ferrotypes, or of Carte de Visite size; cabinet cards, such as
the
> > image in question, did not become common until the early 1870s.
> > For my part, I am curious as to where the exact “dating” of these items
of
> > 1869 derives from….. are the blocks signed, or is there some sort of documentation?
> Soooo…we have a photo that’s been ‘adjusted’ in some way. The women are obviously not in mid-to-late 19th century everyday clothing. But…that doesn’t mean they’re not mid-to-late 19th century women. It could be that they were celebrating a centennial, and were costumed according to their abilities. (I’ll never forget the time that I was costuming a Renaissance group, and one woman volunteered, ‘My daughter already has a costume- she was in the centennial last year!’ ) They may just have been really lousy costumers– figuring that if they put Puritan collars and mobcaps on over their regular dresses, that that would be all the effort required. For that matter, they may have figured it would be a waste of time and money to make up a real Puritan dress to wear just for the celebration. So…they may have started the quilt in 1869, and then, a few years later after the larger photographs became available, had the portrait made then. Maybe they happened to know a photographer who was really on the cutting edge of his art, or maybe, the blocks were made in 1869, and 10 or so years later, someone stumbled across them again and said, ‘Wouldn’t it be a hoot to get our picture made, in our old centennial costumes?’
> I’d think that someone who was deliberately trying to create a hoax would have been smart enough to have created a picture without any anachronistic elements in it…but then, maybe I’m just an optimist. <G>
> Jocelyn
> Jocelynm [at] delphi [dot] com
Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 14:42:09 -0400 | From: “sue reich” <mreich [at] ibm [dot] net>
I was most interested in the discussion about the photograph sold on Ebay. I didn’t post earlier because I wasn’t sure if I could unearth a similar photograph of my Great Grandmother.
Eureka! I found it, today.
My Grandmother gave it to me years ago. Her mother is one of eight young women, posed with their plumed hats in their hands. My Grandmother always said this was a photo of her mother’s Sewing School. There are two penciled dates on the back of the photo – Oct.11, 1887 and Oct. 11, 1897. My Great Grandmother’s last name was Cassidy from Oil City, PA.
Sorry, I don’t have a scanner to show you all. I am going to be at the Conference on Friday at about 6:30 p.m. through Saturday night. I’ll be sure to bring it. I’ll attempt to do more research before Friday.
sue reich
Date: Tue, 3 Aug 1999 18:37:52 EDT | From: EllynLK [at] aol [dot] com
I looked at the photo and wish it was clearer… however, I don’t think the photo is from 1869.
At that time, each photograph taken had its own “wet plate” which was coated with light sensitive emulsion, placed in the camera and exposed to light by removing the lens cap and focusing on the subject (in the late 1860s this would have been a period of less than a minute). Lens cap was replaced, the wet plate was removed and immediately developed into a negative before it was dry. The photos you see of that period were small– because * you could only take a photo the size of your wet plate. * The uncommon size of the photo would have meant an uncommon size of wet plate and uncommon size of camera. There WERE larger photos taken; some of you may have seen an old picture of a gigantic camera perched on a building in preparation to take a panoramic shot of some city. This was a specially-built camera camera with a huge specially-sized wet plate for a huge photo– because there were no blow-ups back then. The photo was the size of the wet plate. Therefore, for the photo to be authentic, it would have had to have been taken with a special camera. Since the photo isn’t spectacular, the question would be “why bother”? Since many “photographers” were barbers or dentists with a photographic studio upstairs for extra money, not many people would have had specially-sized cameras. And if they did, they likely wouldn’t have taken ordinary photos with them, but special pictures (like the city panorama).
Without passing judgement on whether the photo is of the quilt pieces in question, I just question an “1869” photo of that size. Not impossible, but curious.
Lauri Klobas
